Matchday discussion

Do you think Toby wouldn’t have cleared the first goal? Or do you think Toby wouldn’t have told Rodon that there was a man on and demand a clearance? One change should have been Dier for.....Toby

 

No David Moyes is not the modern progressive coach but he does get the best from what he has which nobody can say about Jose just ask man united

 

I believe that’s rodon will be a good buy when he settles and gets to play with someone other than Dier.Who could replace Moura I believe we loaned him to Norwich..?We also sold a right back who is outperforming our two to Southampton.Their manager seems able to get a tune from him that Jose couldn’t why?

 

GK - Lloris
CB - Rodon and Toby
LB - Regy / Davies
RB - Tanganga (until we sign a RB)
DCM - PEH
DCM - Sissoko
CM - Ndombele
LF - Son
RF - Bale
CF - Kane / Vini

Subs: PG, Dier, Davies, Cirkin, Skipp, White, Bergwijn, Lo Celso, Vini, Scarlett

 

Would you still take 5 of United’s players after their magnificent performances against Arsenal and SU?

 

It is not whom you take IN from whoever. It is whom you take OUT from the opponent. Take out of LFC lineup Mane and we could have had an entirely different result. And no personal mistakes from Spurs. The man is a superb footballer and Pool plays as good as he does. He is not as consistent as he was last season, so there was a chance to get by them, but Spurs were unlucky to get a good Mane Thursday.

 

True but that wasn’t the point being made....the point was several people were saying how bad our starting 11 is and how many would get in to United’s team. Not sure what you think but I would take 3 of them

 

Why would we sell 2 of our best players and where have I said or hinted this should happen anywhere ?

So that's just a nonsense statement completely.

 

All managers even the saviour the lord Jesus Poch make decisions and set up teams that leave u thinking that's not what I'd do.
It's not exclusive to JM , how many times would Poch not play Jannssen or Llorente when Kane was injured?
Never played a RB with no left foot at LB oh except for Trippier...
Or we'd need a goal so on the standard 70 minute mark off would come a wing back in rose for a non attacking average LB Davies?
Or his favourite absolutely no reaction at all to what's unfolding on the pitch....

So all this selective outrage is embarrassing.

At Anfield we sat back contained and missed numerous sitters really we were very unlucky to lose to a last minute goal, n everyone was crying about possession and why we hadn't played Liverpool off the park at their own ground which was heading for a record of being unbeaten (which by the way the tactically inept dinosaur holds).
So we had basically 50/50 possession this time we didn't camp in our own box and try to contain we just don't have enough about our side to cause other teams problems especially when Kane goes off n Son is currently off form (which he's always prone to for a spell) and what happened we lost more convincingly due to being open at the back and actually created less.

So 2 game plans were tried both failed but the 1st 1 you all cried about was actually better than trying to play against pool.

Seriously watch the goals conceded mid week again n unless JM puts some boots n gloves on and does the basics our 'internationals' can't then how can he be blamed for that level incompetence?

Personally (for balance and more bodies in midfield)

Idv gone 352 lloris Toby Dier Rodon , Aurrier Sissoko N'Dombele Hojbjerg Davies , Son Kane and when Kane got injured Vinnie would've come on

But would that have worked?
Is anyones guess there's probably people that would see that n say Dier?? Where's Winks??? You've left Lamela out??? 3 at the back???

Would Dier Aurrier Davies Rodon & Sissoko be anywhere near a team I was incharge of? No but I'd still pick them when you look at the alternatives and injuries.

See what I'm getting at?

 

You mean all this time you had the answer???
Your 'alternatives' included 7 that started, another who came on making 8 that played, a LB that was injured/unavailable, a prospect CB at RB & Sissoko.
This team turns over Liverpool for sure.
Someone get Levy on the phone we've got a managerial genius on our hands.

 

By this logic you think a slow past his best Toby is the answer to all our defensive woes (coz we've not shipped any when he's been on the pitch oh except at Anfield) , he could of marked Mane Firminho & Salah while instructing Aurrier how to play football while covering his inexperienced partner and make goal keeping decisions too?

I'm a big fan of Toby but the man is not a 1 man brick wall

 

Only Won a Domestic cup & European cup whilst finishing runner up in the league yeah he did awful with players like Jones Smalling Darmian Rojo Fellaini and Lingard to work with.
What a shocker

 

Now, now....that’s not what I said is it? I do think his communication would have been way better than Dier and and his instinct as a defender is way better so yes, instead of stepping out of the way to leave it for Lloris who didn’t come, he would have swung a leg at it

 

Bahahahaha...wasn’t saying if it would turnover Liverpool or not but was following your high level logic of us having a terrible squad. Have a look at the formation of my “alternatives” because at least they would be in a position they can actually play in. As you seem to be the godfather of doom for our players, I had a look who we could have with all of the usual suspects removed and if it would be any worse. Still give Levy a bell because clearly JM isn’t doing a great job so it couldn’t be much worse.

 

You juggled around 8 players that played and your only changes were Toby Sissoko & Vinnie.
So you've proven my point barring 1 or 2 due to injury he fielded our strongest team but in a different formation, change the formation and you're just guessing it'd do better, look for who's on the bench and there isn't much better, play an inexperienced CB at RB in the hope he'd do better.
The sheer fact another inexperienced CB was bought last knockings from a mediocre Championship side n is already being clamoured for to start even though the couple games he's played he's had a clanger in just exposes how bad defensive options we have.
As I said earlier it doesn't matter how you shuffle the pack if it's loaded with duds.
But you think you could do better using basically the same team which is really the Baaaaahaha moment.
In your world this squad is exceptional and it's all JMs fault, when a defender and goalkeeper give a pass across the 6yard box a guard of honour to Firminho that's because of Mourinho.
Everytime a team has the audacity to win the ball and attack us that's because of Mourinho.
Because the team with such error prone players (but mostly who you'd pick) doesn't dominate Liverpool away or at home that's Mourinhos fault.
When it rains outside is that his fault? Or Covid?

 

Mmmmmm...not really. I’ve suggested 4 changes to the starting line up and 6 changes to the bench which also would have resulted in 3 different substitutes and no place for any of the dross that you consistently call out as the main reason for our performances & results.

At no stage have I ever said we have an exceptional squad so not sure where you have got that from.

I do firmly believe that JM should carry the blame given his salary and his constant desire to start 7 defenders while making terrible decisions around substitutions but if we have 11 players all ignoring his instructions and choosing not to improve in the months that he has been coaching them then it is indeed all on them...JM has done a brilliant job both tactically and individually to ensure they have all increased their market values, it’s such a shame they decide to just ignore everything he has taught them each week (yet somehow they still get picked).

 

Serious questions and please answer each one -

For the 1st goal-

Do you think he instructed Aurrier to lose his runner?
Instructed Lloris not to call for or claim the ball?
Instructed Dier on not hearing a call to just casually let the ball run between him and Lloris?

For the 2nd goal-

Instructed Doherty to be turned (who was somehow in the RB position???) by mane to get a shot off?
Instructed Lloris to Palm a tame shot straight to an unmarked TAA?

For the 3rd goal-

Instructed them to let a cross come in unchallenged?
Instructed Rodon to control the ball for mane to tuck away?

And lastly do you think players are to take absolutely no responsibility for any of these absolute howlers?

Because they're either working perfectly to plan which is JMs fault or they're taking matters into their own hands and playing abysmally like the clowns they are.

Surely 7 defenders that can't take care of these situations shows a complete level of clownery????

 

Has N'Dombele improved ?
Have Son & Kane broke records ?
Is Hojbjerg a better player ?
Has Aurrier improved (from 2019) ?
Has Lloris improved ? (from 2019) ?

Literally the only player that's got worse is Dilly Dally and that's on him no 1 else.

You can't say players have got worse because unless you're being completely disingenuous the likes of Dier Sanchez Davies Winks Sissoko Moura Lamela etc have always been extremely meh

 

Of course...

1st goal - He picked Dier and Aurier to play against Mane who attacks behind the space in which Aurier is supposed to defend. He coaches Dier every day and a basic of defending is to clear the ball first and never let it run across goal.

2nd goal - He picked Doherty who should have been at LB which led to Lloris indeed palming the very tame shot into the path of TAA who was left unmarked because he (LB) was in the wrong position being turned (RB)

3rd goal - He picked both Doherty and Aurier who left huge gaps in the spaces that they should have been defending along with picking Dier who as the other CB should have been talking constantly to Rodon (as the experienced England and PL CB selected) knowing that Rodon is both young and inexperienced.

To answer your question...of course the players need to take responsibility for mistakes, lack of communication and loose passing however JM has to take responsibility for picking his starting 11, choosing the formation that with players that are not capable of completing the tasks he asks of them week in and week out and not making the right changes to influence the game when needed.

We absolutely have several clowns but why continue to pick them if they let us down week after week? We also have players more than capable of filling positions such as Bale and Vini, why not use them? Why not use Sissoko instead of Winks when we are clearly being overrun and when we need to make yards not pass sideways or straight to them? Given his form for Norwich, why not bring Skipp back and use him in that space? Why drop Toby against a side out of form or why leave Tanganga out of the squad completely when he is fit? Why play Doherty who week in and week out let’s us down at LB when he cannot kick with his left foot yet we have Davies playing who can play at LB and Toby or even Sanchez (god forbid) on the bench?

 

Ndombele- yes, massive improvement but is that due to settling or JM, not sure?
Son and Kane are breaking records but lets not overlook how good they have been for the last 3 years
Is Hojbjerg better, not really? He has been very good for Southampton.
Aurier had not improved at all IMO, still very unpredictable and has no defensive positional awareness
Lloris, no better than any other season, if anything seems to be getting worse IMO.

All of the rest of the names you mentioned, I fully agree except Davies & Sissoko (as squad players) but each of them do have alternative options so why pick them?