Matchday discussion

That could mean they are due for a loss.

 

I don't disagree, yet blaming previous regime was supposed to be reserved for the season end when club gets empty-handed. Isn't it a bit premature?
As funny as it maybe, I believe Mou can make things better. He can improve the back end without new defenders. We don't have poor defenders, we have an adequate defenders doing poor job.
Our defense did improve in terms of structure under Mou, but the defeat to Saints was due to inability of our offence to break their defense down. We also had Mike Dean, an enemy of Spurs and walking human waste, to referee the game. I was surprised he didn't give penalty for Verts handball, but was not at all surprised when he denied an obvious penalty to Dele. That could change the game earlier in our favor and who knows what the result could be.
So, I wouldn't be so negative that early, although I am quite upset at the moment. COYS!!!

 

I agree JM can make things better than they were at the start of the season, I don’t agree about the defenders:
Alderweireld - Decent but slow
Sanchez - Quick but very unpredictable and prone to errors
Vertonghen - Decent but very slow
Aurier - No positional awareness for defending at all and can’t cross
KWP - Not strong enough and makes poor decisions when being run at
Foyth - Tries to be play way too much and often gets caught. Not big enough to play CB
Rose - Has moments of quality going forward and occasional brilliant tackles coming back but often out of position and often gives the ball away
Davies - Good back up for CB & LB but has no pace at all
Dier - Unbelievably slow and always gives the ball away. I wouldn’t trust him at CB or CM

I don’t think we can blame the ref and don’t agree that anyone would have given a penalty because Alli drops to the ground with a wind gust these days.

Thanks to how poor all of the other teams around us are, we could still have a top 4 chance. That’s not positive though when week in and week out we are relying on other teams to try and get a top 4 place.

QUOTE="Spurporter, post: 17899, member: 120"]I don't disagree, yet blaming previous regime was supposed to be reserved for the season end when club gets empty-handed. Isn't it a bit premature?
As funny as it maybe, I believe Mou can make things better. He can improve the back end without new defenders. We don't have poor defenders, we have an adequate defenders doing poor job.
Our defense did improve in terms of structure under Mou, but the defeat to Saints was due to inability of our offence to break their defense down. We also had Mike Dean, an enemy of Spurs and walking human waste, to referee the game. I was surprised he didn't give penalty for Verts handball, but was not at all surprised when he denied an obvious penalty to Dele. That could change the game earlier in our favor and who knows what the result could be.
So, I wouldn't be so negative that early, although I am quite upset at the moment. COYS!!![/QUOTE]

 

Thoughts......JM impressions ...

So ....... we know something of Mourinho - Self opinionated, always right, smart, likes to have the last word, cuts people down with his sharp tongue, doesn’t keep things to himself.

So ....... take the “are you Dele or his brother”, a typical JM smart arsed comment. What happens. Press laugh, Dele gets his finger our, scores goals, everybody wins.

So......Dele’s young, might not be think skinned, starts playing bad again, JM criticises him.....lose at Saints, storms off down the tunnel, no travelling fan acknowledgement....result, a problem brewing.

So.....elsewhere individual player performances are shite...team performance also - Norwich and Saints were amongst the worst team performances I’ve seen for a while.

So.....the players have been used to Poch’s warm, touchy/feely, arm around shoulder style of management. That’s not JM, at all.

There is a very public view about who might be going. Whilst it may be speculation, it certainly does not help one bit - up to half of the first team squad....loadsa players. Players talk, perhaps he’s rubbing them up the wrong way, he’s not exactly subtle is he......time will tell......

 

So a visit to the rejuvenated and in form Watford in today's early kick off.

We have a new Signing in Gedson Fernandes for our troublesome CM position whether he gets a game or not is yet to be seen.

We drew with them in the Home fixture earlier this season where if we are being honest they probably deserved to win and this was when they were rooted to the bottom of the league.

Although they were bottom from what I've seen of them their actual play has been much better than the position they'd found themselves in. It looks like Pearson has given it the organisation it needed to turn performances into wins.

2 players I really like at Watford are Dacoure and Deulofeu think these 2 are stand out in their side Dacoure I'd like to see in our CM personally and stopping these 2 will be essential to our game today. They also have the battering ram Deeney making his way back so if he plays gonna need muscle in the CB department.

Watford always a difficult place to go and get a result but that we must do.

Hopefully after good midweek performance from Tanganga, Lamela & LoCelso they all play again today we need players that want to fight for the side and drag this club out of its post Poch/CL final hangover.

Really wanna see some consistency again in selection which to be fair to Mourinho he does look like he is searching for which has at least had us looking more balanced.

Gonna need to start alert and at the races and be prepared to dig in and battle for spells in this 1.

Prediction hard fought 1-2
COYS !

 

Agree on doucoure we paid 63m ndombele 55m lo celso fernandes 45m obviously if all are made permanent which I hope they do it will mean they have proved thier worth while all along the Watford man been there staring us in the face and probably cheaper despite being consistent over 3 yrs in the prem and scores goals. However centre mid remains a problem area but given the numbers we have there right now the competition hopefully drives two to come forward and prove they can not only protect a vulnerable back 4/5 but also give us the control in that area that you need to go on and take games away from teams and compete with the better ones. Personally I think needs and deserves an chance to play more centrally. He's not a wide mid and probably not a no10. Ideally he needs to play alongside a quality orthodox no4 that we don't seem to have at present with dier out of form, Skipp not yet trusted and winks not positionally sound enough but seems to be pick of a bad bunch. Where ndombele fernandes and lo celso play when all fit I'm not sure. Maybe we're heading to a multi functional mid 3 like Liverpool which is an idea I like but that would require an upgrade on moura/lamela to add goals and assists if the front 3 are left to furrow on thier own up top. Werner would be my shout but that's for another forum.
We need to put together a regular bk 4 and stick with it for them to gain some familiarity, cohesion and consistency and bare with it. Lloris may benefit coming back into a side now that is not obsessed with playing out from the back kamikaze style as he more than most struggled and his nerves spread. My bk 4 for the remainder of the season and today's 11 for today are as follows.
Gazza tanganga Toby Jan sessagnon. Winks lo celso. Moura alli lamela Son.
Subs vorm aurier sanchez fernandes Skipp parrot Rose.

 

Another dross performance although Watford under Pearson have been hard to beat.Can anyone explain to me what Moura brings to the role of centre forward.I forgot he was playing he was so invisible.He is a wide man only and it is no coincidence that Sons form is not as good when Moura plays down the middle.The much maligned Gazzinga saves us again.We are still defensively a mess and lack pace. surely Sanchez is now better than vertongan even though he had a mare in the cup game.I do hope that Mourino settles on a position for Tarangana and not left back where he had a torrid time today.Anybody wish we had signed Dacore.The most worrying stat is that we have not won a league game since Kane’s injury so a centre forward is vital post haste and stop worrying about what happens when Kane is fit because he will have to fight for his place like anyone else

 

Does Mourino watch the same game as me as he. thought we should have won.Im guessing it is a bit of confidence booster because no sane person could say we should have won.Our new signing looked at home in his short time on the pitch and now we need ndombele fit and maybe we will have some creativity in midfield.Trying Ali there is a no no he is a number ten and needs to play there to regain confidence if not get rid with Dier and a few more of the deadwood .As I said before we have not won in league since Kane’s injury and have not scored in 4 of them.Doesnt
Need a magic ball to see the urgency of a striker or we will struggle to finish top 6 and no European money spells trouble

 

We're so far off being a top 4 side now it's a joke.
Although I wanted them included it's only because they actually try but players of Lamela LoCelso Winks etc just have absolutely nothing about their games.
The shambles of a Striker situation is what it has been for ages just a farce.

There's absolutely no fluidity to our play, lost count the amount of times we get the ball and there's literally no movement from the whole side , is this laziness/a training/or ability issue????

 

Another two points lost or a point gained - depends if your glass is half-empty or half-full. Have to say, looking at a table that shows we've dropped 38 points from 23 games, my half-empty glass is now three-quarters empty at best. I'm certainly not advocating a Mourinho-out movement but, come on man, convince me that there's something better about to happen 'cos I see nothing at all. All right, Watford are, at the moment, a form side but nothing more than a spirited lower reach team. We've struggled twice this season to take a total of two points off them, which really suggests we're no better than they are. Could have won, except for the last-millimetre clearance but we would be kidding ourselves to claim it was deserved. Deeney's penalty miss (or Gazzaniga's save, I'll credit him) got us out of jail and on that point - what was the difference between Jan's handball and the Watford man's after 2 minutes? I saw none anyway - perhaps Mr Oliver can enlighten us. Oh well, get used to mid-table mediocrity for a while guys, 'cos unless there's a startling change, we're increasingly looking the part.

 

It's the players Gordon , I actually think Mourinho has at least organised it better and stopped us playing suicidal football to be fair on him.
From the 16/17 side that finished 2nd 86 points we no longer have Dembele or Walker, Wanyama is propping up the treatment room waiting for his departure, CE is gone mentally and is stealing a living along with Rose, Dier/Alli/Lloris are shells of their former selves, Toby & Jan aren't what they were, Lamela has never been good enough and like many of them is injury prone and highly inconsistent.
That is not just an oversight with now a few tweaks needed it's a catastrophic level of negligence from Levy & Pochettino.

I look at LoCelso and Sessegnon and I don't see upgrades or Top 4 quality, N'Dombele can't string more than 60minutes, Moura is a conundrum & Sanchez/Aurier/Foyth are just liabilities the recruitment has been so so poor and has left us with so many different issues it's gonna take 3 windows of aggressive strategic player purchasing and selling to sort it out.

The squad is shockingly poor imo

 

I don't get what is that you want, really. A dominant attacking football? Then Spurs got a wrong manager. Spurs played well defensively, Mou gets his mark on the team ( I omit penalty conceded and saved, since it is not a tactical thing). For his football Spurs have to have a better conversion of chances. Dele had to score. Ball should have crossed the line in full. Things like that are required for Mou to win. Is he relying on luck? Not really, he needs 3 Harry Kanes playing behind Harry Kane figuratively speaking, so the luck we need currently will not be abig factor.. Then his football will be effective. Spurs are not far off. In other words, I fully agree with Felon 82 below:

 

What I want spurporter is players who can pass the ball to their own team consistently who chase and try to win the ball back when they lose it.That would be a start and no I don’t expect free flowing football under Mourino although his first Chelsea title winning team were a joy to watch.What I don’t want is the mess that pochetino left being made worse because of lack of investment.I will accept half a dozen 1 nils at the moment if it improves our league position but we must buy a centre forward because Moura is not the answer and Son is beginning to look frustrated.If we are not careful we will have more than one of our better payers looking to jump ship

 

It’s amazing what can change in a year....we have players, who last year looked energetic and fit, looking pretty old and tired fairly soon into games now. Even more shocking is the loss of pace and desire. It’s like we seem to have missed 5 years in some kind of time warp.

We have signings who we thought could drive us into contention with Liverpool and City who are in fact adding no value to the squad at all really.

I can’t believe some people think that Lo Celso is a great signing based on what we have seen so far...if he is on loan and we have an option to return him in the summer, that’s exactly what I would be doing (not trying to sign him early for $40 million odd). Jack Grealish would be a much better signing and is built to play in the premier league (meaning his experience is not La Liga/Ligue 1/Serie A where the pace is much slower and opposition much lower in quality except a few standout sides).

For the last few seasons we have been expecting performances against the top sides (both in the league and Europe).

In the blink of an eye, we are now thinking about how we played reasonably well drawing 0-0 with Watford. In football terms, I actually feel a bit sad about it.

I’m in the same boat, I think we had a few players who played well, a few not so well and yet again a couple of stinkers.

JM is doing a reasonable job given the players/form/injuries he is dealing with but some decisions still seem to confuse me.
Tanganga who clearly can’t kick with his left foot should be starting at CB or RB.

I know some people are hesitant about a large scale change in squad but without it we will be back to competing for the EL with Arsenal.

It’s time to face the facts, JM will not turn us into anything special unless he is allowed to spend big and even if he is, we have no one at the club making sure the players we sign will work in the PL (Fernandes is an example of what we should do where possible though so hopefully that will change).
Unless we invest in a standout keeper, LB, CDM, CAM and forward the good times will still be some way away.

Good point but disappointing result

 

Thoughts....

- for me it wasn’t a great watch, painful in fact.

- Capoue should have been sent off,

- Doucoure should have been purchased ages ago

- without Sissoko and the real Dembele we are so lightweight in midfield....lots of 10 stone weaklings

- I feel sorry for Moura - he’s just not a centre forward. We MUST buy a striker ffs

- thought Gazza did well and apart from the Kung Fu incident has covered the loss of Lloris pretty well for me

- Lo Celso I quite like, given his newness to the EPL

I go into every game feeling it’s another banana skin, but at least we didn’t lose and the “others” didn’t gain ground on us, as long as you don’t count Wolves.... Newcastle even. Talking about Wolves Jimenez cost what was it £30m, or two of him for Ndombele....we really have got our transfer seeking heads up our backsides. In fact Doucoure and Jimenez for Ndombele. I’ll take that.

 

Couldn’t agree more with everything that you have said however think that Gazza has done well as a back up keeper...IMO we need to replace Lloris with someone like Oblak from Athletico Madrid and have a keeper who is reliable and can kick.

Lo Celso is new but is very small, lightweight and can’t really shoot....I hear what you are saying but do you think he is value for $40 million or should we try and get someone who is not new to English football for $40 million? That would be my preference personally (there are a few MF’s who we could get for that money - look at Tielemans/Grealish/Ward-Prouse/Neves as a few examples of what you can buy for under $40 million

 

We have too many players not good enough that need replacing immediately.
A tough ask for any manager.

 

In a blink of an eye Watford turned into decent side. They were solid. We would rather have won in October, but we know what we were then.

 

We should have got Maddison when he was £25m, also Grealish at the same proce, Sess when he was £5m, Doucoure, Jimenez...….the list goes on. I think Lo Celso is working hard, and let's face it Modric wasn't exactly a big strong lad...……..

 

It's weird how individuals see the game personally I thought we were ok in the 1st half considering the players we had available but pretty much toothless in the last 3rd which is quite obvious when you have two wide attacking players who tend to run into trouble due to playing with their heads down as for Lamela probably the most annoying player to play for Spurs in a very long time runs a lot works a lot but never has and never will pass unless there is no other option Lo Celso actually tried to drive us forward although he is a bit lightweight he doesn't mind a tackle is he good enough to make a difference time will tell but if we had a target man we could hold on to the ball I get releasing the ball quicker but it just keeps coming back if we don't get someone in then we will lucky to get top 6 although maybe that would be a good thing Mourinho might force Levy/ENIC to release some money however I won't hold my breath