Would Levy really Kane it for cash....again?

Discussion in 'Tottenham forum' started by Mattj78, March 26, 2015.

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  1. DeadBored Guest

    Oh dear! Here we go again!
    Next we'll be a one man team, and where would we be without the Kane goals?

    Just another merry go round......
     
  2. Felon82 Well-Known Member

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    Very relevant if you read the article it's about Kane and how much he means to us, so to hypothetically suggest where we would be without him is simple. Without Kane would Soldado be the lead scorer in the division then?
    And I knew it wouldn't be long before we had ridiculous 'look at Portsmouth' let's buy 'messi' nonsense, when I say better standard players I mean not enduring the Naughtons, Stamboulis, Kabouls, Chiriches, Sahas, Nelsens, Holtbys, the list goes on and on.
    Spurs standing in the game deserves much better players than this that are affordable, if we can Spunk 73mill on Soldado Lamela and Paulinho we should have a higher caliber of player and progressed we have not.
     
  3. Spurporter Well-Known Member

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    How much Bale is paid per week by Blancos?
     
  4. Big Mal Guest

    Ah, time to play the hindsight card now is it Felon. You are absolutely priceless. When we bought Paulinho he was rated as one of the best box to box midfielders in the world playing regularly for arguably the best team in the world; Soldado's goal scoring record was/is incredible and he was seen by everyone (except you presumably) as exactly the striker we needed. Lamela was scoring goals in Italy and was in the Argentina squad. The press said we had sold Elvis and bought the Beatles. many experts were saying we now had the squad to challenge. These players haven't delivered so we have spunked the money away; we should have signed lots of different players. Your latest 'I don't know anything about football' confession is you list of players - Naughton, Stambouli, Kaboul, Chiriches, Saha, Nelsen, Holtby. Well let me explain. Teams no longer have an eleven; they have a squad (it happened quite a while ago, but we know you are the hard of learning and are struggling to keep up). That squad will have players who 'do a job' as only clubs owned by billionaires (see previous post) can have 22 top quality players. So naughton - reserve who does a job is as good as any reserve right back; as is Stambouli and Kaboul (very highly rated and excellent before his injuries problems but now - hindsight again- useless no doubt). Holtby is still rated very highly by most fans and at £1.5m and a huge profit an absolute no brainer - surely even someone with your understanding of football can see that. Saha was worth a punt on a free and scored a few goals; ditto Nelson when we needed a centre half as back up. When Kane has a dodgy spell, no doubt you'll be saying he was rubbish all along. As always, loads of hindsight and absolutely no solutions. Highlighting Southampton as one successful club (after a hundred years of failure mind you); stating we sell 'all' (your words) our top players; listing squad players that EVERY club has to have. Every comment you make gets more ridiculous, but the essence is always 'let's keep all our top players and buy lots more brilliant ones'. Yeah, thanks for that.
     
  5. Felon82 Well-Known Member

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    Southampton have spent roughly 78 mil on players in those 5 years and we have roughly spent 220 mil, not including extra European money, better prem TV deals etc for Southampton to leap frog us from 2 divisions below this is great Business from Spurs?
    You did say i dont understand finances right?
    Wanting our best players to stay and wanting us to buy a better achievable standard of player to complement them in the hope it will help keep them as it gives the top players the platform they deserve makes me not understand football?

    At what part is wanting that wrong?
    Do you not want better players then?
    Do you want kane to stay or not?
    You do so why are you arguing with me for suggesting what we need to do more of to keep players of such ilk?

    Just have a read of what your flipping out about.

    In fact reading this last bit is priceless- you dont agree we should keep our best players and add more quality ones to them?
    And i dont understand football ?

    Whats the answer sell them then? Or buy more sub standard players?
     
  6. Big Mal Guest

    Felon, you can't actually read can you? So get someone to read this to you. Southampton have done brilliantly after 100 years of failure. Occasionally this happens. About 30 other clubs have failed dismally attempting to do the same so just pick out the one who at the moment are succeeding. Our net spend is nothing, so yes if it's business your talking about, it's very good. Our best players won't stay; they will always go to Real if they are good enough - this is so obvious it's ridiculous although, I guess, they may stay at a smaller club for £250K less, but not sure. Ronaldo left United for a bigger club. I want our best players to stay, but there is a food chain and Tottenham are moving up it and the new stadium that you don't think will be built is the key. No you don't understand finances because you think players will stay at Tottenham and that we can afford much better players with much higher salaries. If we could, we would buy them as would every club. We buy more than most - Modric, Bale Berba, Lloris, Eriksen, Jan etc. etc. (only you have the hindsight gift to know that some of these were poor buys. I am amazed you aren't in football. So, when a friend has read my points let me know where I said we should sell our top players or where I said we should buy sub standard ones.
     
  7. Felon82 Well-Known Member

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    I have said we should buy a better standard of player to complement our best players in tempting them to stay, you have argued this point as if i am wrong in this statement which would lead anyone to believe you disagree with wanting a better standard player to help our best players stay?
    But when you go round the houses in essence you agree with me?
    Quite confusing really.

    Il state again we need to stop stock piling mediocre and sub standard players, improve the quality and reliability in the Team to help propel us forward so that we are playing next level football, this hopefully will put us in a stronger position to keep our best players as we are giving them the platform they crave,
    Do you agree or not agree with this ?
    If you dont agree that would mean you think opposite to this, hence i can understand you calling me out and arguing with me?

    Do you want our best players to stay?
    Do you think a better caliber of player supporting would help this?
     
  8. burnt Guest

    You have come up with some good points to be fair Mal but to suggest we,d still be in same position without our 3 best players this season is a bit strange .. Where would the goals have come from without Kane .. All the evidence we,ve seen so far would suggest our other 2 strikers wouldn't have scored what he has in a million years .. Also to suggest Kanes rise is not really a surprise is fanciful to say the least .. Jeez everyone in the game is saying they didn't see it coming .. If i or anyone else in the world had said at the end of last season that Kane would end up being our No1 striker next year and he would score more then anyone else in the league who would have believed that .. Also we did try and sign Wickham but the price was all wrong .. So while Fenlon does write a lot of nonsense at times as all of us do , he does make some good points at times just like yourself ..
     
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  9. Felon82 Well-Known Member

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    Dont Burnt youl make me blush.

    Listen Big Mal i thank you for your compliments throughout but this has severely ran its course now and my friend reading me your posts is going home now.

    Keep clapping.
     
  10. Big Mal Guest

    Burnt. Thanks for the comment. A few points. We did NOT at any stage try to sign Connor Wickham. The discussion NEVER got past the stage of Harry Kane is better. Everyone at Tottenham knew he was special which is why a decision was made to loan him out at 17, a year earlier than we usually loan players out and why we loaned him to a premier league club as soon as we could. No one knew (obviously) that he would score so many, but no one at the club is surprised. My point about the three best players is simple. They play for Tottenham so it's irrelevant. Most team have 3 crucial players so every club could say the same. Without them we would have an extra £90m and would simply replace them. If we simply lost them without replacing them Soldado/Ade; Lamela/Chadli/Dembele and Vorm would replace them so the drop in points would not be that dramatic. We are about 8 points clear of 8th so I don't think we would fall that far, but the argument is ALWAYS irrelevant and the most pointless of all arguments. What would Arsenal have won without Henry? Who cares? He plays for Arsenal. It is impossible to tell what would happen if someone is not there. If Kane can come from 'nowhere' and score 29 goals why can't someone else? Why can't Ade or Soldado rediscover their form? My point is simply that Felon states that we'd be relegation fodder without Eriksen, Kane and Lloris, but we bought 2 and developed one. The recruitment was brilliant as was the development so why is he making such a ridiculous point. It actually shows what a fantastic job the club are doing, although Felon was somehow trying to make out that it was a 'bad thing'. 'We have 3 amazing players, but just imagine if we didn't?' Ridiculous. COYS
     
  11. Mattj78

    Mattj78 Well-Known Member

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    When were Spurs last anything near successful? 1981 maybe?
    34 years of glorious failure. With the odd trophy now and again.
     
    Felon82 likes this.
  12. burnt Guest

    At the end of the day we can only ever base our assumptions on the evidence we have from the past so i think its fair to say it would have been unlikely if Soldado or Ade would have done the business if it hadn't worked out for Kane , but hey who knows .. I think the one thing we can all agree on is between now and the end of season we need to see improvements in the defensive side of our game , in a league full of teams that cant defend we are one of the worst .. We can all pick names we don't like and blame them but theres more to it than just been down to individuals ..
     
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  13. burnt Guest

    The landscape has changed a lot since 1981 and unfortunately we,ve fallin a million miles behind in terms of revenue so expecting us to compete at the top now is unrealistic .. Its not impossible mind you if everything dropped right for you in terms of getting a group of players and a manager all singing from the same hymn sheet , look what they're doing at Athletico but it would take a minor miracle and in the long run it wont last .. Hopefully getting this new stadium will be the first step all be it a major one in clawing our way back among the elite ..
     
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  14. Mattj78

    Mattj78 Well-Known Member

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    What people forget is that while the stadium is built, there will be little money for new players which is one of the reasons Poch was brought in because it was known that he could bring through the talent from within the youth system.
    I am all for that but there is a danger that while we move away from the lane we could fall further behind our rivals. Then we move back into a brand new stadium and possibly have to start all over again.
    The next three seasons will be ones of more treading water.
    After that, then possibly we can start to compete in the top four. Until then, I doubt we will finish any higher than fifth or sixth.
     
  15. Burnt Guest

    That has to be a very real possibility , its going to be a very tricky few years for those at the top trying to balance everything and a very frustrating time for the fans id imagine ..
     
  16. Jonesy Guest

    "The recruitment was brilliant" - I'm not sure that's entirely true!? C'mon there have been some shocking acquisitions which IMO Felon has correctly identified, whilst missing out on some targets that would have improved the team e.g. Willian, Wickham (clearly I'm joking about the latter! - the above posts re. him brought a smile to my face). Anyhow, as for the former, that was a big clanger on Baldini's part. Instead we dithered, Chelski took him out the market, and then we ended up with Lamela - I know which one I would rather have and which one would suit Poch's "philosophy" more. I'm sure Poch and even dear old AVB would concur too.

    The concern at the moment has to be the fact that we are leaking far too many goals and it needs to be addressed PDQ. On a positive note the club are making the right noises and are already making reference to the summer transfer window; so one would hope that Poch has some targets lined up, Levy & Lewis back him and we get the business done early for a change i.e. selling appropriately, buying carefully, retaining Lloris, Eriksen et al and giving considered opportunities for our academy players too.

    COYS!
     
  17. Jonesy Guest

    Get in Kane! Great goal and only on the pitch 1min and 20secs!!!
     
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  18. notnats

    notnats Well-Known Member

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    Agree and I think weve all asked the hypothetical about where would we be this year without the immense contributions of our three best players as well as the incredibly fortunate and meteoric rise of Harry Kane, and I use the word fortunate and not lucky because as Big Mal correctly points out ( great posts by the way ) the club always knew that this player was special and has done a fantastic job throughout his development. While I kind of agree that arguing what or where would we be without these three players and their contributions is mostly redundant because, and again pointed out by BM, they are of course Spurs players and the club has done very well and should be given some credit for the recruitment and development of such players. However, and purely hypothetically speaking, id hate to see we we'd be without Harry's goals this year.
     
  19. Big Mal Guest

    Jonesy. Read my post again and you will find the 'recruitment was brilliant' comment is about Lloris and Eriksen - I could not have made that any clearer. Like every club, there will be signings that don't work out. Tottenham get it right more than most clubs because they have to. The 7 we bought with the Bale money were regarded by everyone in the press as excellent signings to a man. How could we ever perceive that Soldado would go from scoring goals for fun in Spain for a club similar to Tottenham to not scoring? How could we perceive that Brazil's central midfielder would struggle when he appeared to be exactly what we needed etc. The fact is they all looked good signings at the time. We did not dither over Willian in any way; quite the opposite. Tottenham have attempted to sign Aguero, Mata, Oscar, Marin, Hazard and Willian before any other club because we know this is the only way we can get them. Chelsea simply wait for us to make a move then double the transfer fee and triple the wages. Not hard when you have a billionaire. Willian and his agent were on the phone to Chelsea when he was at Hotspur Way. Tottenham were never his choice of club and the second Chelsea showed an interest £150K seemed a little more exciting than £70K. Tottenham have to move early and pray that the agent keeps quiet!! (No chance there then.) Sometimes it has worked - Modric, Berba, Bale, Lloris, Jan, Eriksen etc. but if Chelsea get wind of what we are doing they blow us out of the water. It's a great tactic and we have done it to teams lower down the food chain latterly when clubs were about to sign Dele Alli.
     
  20. VASpur New Member

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    Big Mal - I agree with everything you've said in this thread because it comes from a rational economic perspective. For some to go on about hypotheticals like where would we be without our best players is an utter waste of time except maybe to those who use is as another tool to bash everything the club does. That Felon82 hates Levy (read his posts) for not spending huge sums of money on transfers and salaries like the big clubs do is irrational.

    And who on this forum would not want to see Tottenham challenge for the league title and compete regularly in the CL? Not me. But where's the money going to come from? Some owners like Abramovich spend money like a Russian billionaire. Joe Lewis spends like an English businessman. Get used to cautious business dealings if you support the latter owner's club. Stop comparing today's relative lack of siverware at Spurs to decades ago, before the PL was established and big money began transforming the game. It's just another pointless waste of time. Tottenham plan's plan for success is not sexy, but it's on the surface it appears realistic and good business. We've lured away scouting mastermind Paul Mitchell from Southampton. We have one of the best training academies in Europe and we've proven that a successful youth program is far more cost effective in helping to sustain healthy club balance sheets through selling developed players than is borrowing to spend on transfers and high wages. I appreciate that Pochettino has brought to the squad a long-missed attitude of not conceding when having gone behind in a match. Yes there are players who have put in poor performances and many of our players are young, lack consistent quality, form and PL experience. Poch is in his first season, has had no opportunity thus far to bring in players that suit his system to replace some of the inherited ones that don't currently fit in. He is investing in youth, training and development which is good business but probably won't win you the league. It will however bring in affordable role players, starters and if lucky, a budding super star Harry Kane. And it will allow the club to grow, i.e., increased ticket revenues from new stadium.

    The negative fans have valid argument in pointing out Levy's history of sacking managers and his cagey contract negotiations for transfer targets. As for selling on our best players... The club can't keep them forever, so you have to sell if the price is right which is for the overall good of the club. And please don't point to his mistakes without mentioning how he's steadied our league performances from year to year and instilled enviable financial discipline to club business. I for one am optimistic (comes from being a yank I suppose) that Levy wants the club to improve as he profits directly from our current level of performance and will do so to a far greater extent in the future if and when the club is sold. Could the club do better at recruiting players of higher quality? Sure, which is why Paul Mitchell was hired. Could Levy improve as a chairman? I don't know. But I do know that while complaining is what all supporters do some of the time, a constant drumbeat of moaning is to me just negative air fouling the room that will not get Levy out. I believe in managing my performance expectations for Spurs in balance with the financial realities of modern football. Regularly getting into the top four in today's game can't be done without either the taking the time to grow the club, or more quickly through the very deep pockets of mega-wealthy foreign owners. Which would path would you prefer?
     
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