Toby Alderweireld replacement ready and waiting

Discussion in 'Featured' started by Josh Bolton, August 3, 2018.

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  1. KevMeist Guest

    I see no point in keeping Toby and then NOT letting him play. As others have said here, our defense is much better with him.


     
  2. Jam Guest

    Risky in the sense that the swap could inadvertently push us from the Champions League this season and beyond

    Martial is a considerable asset.. but unless we change formation I'm not sure where his immediate impact comes from

    But parachute Alderweireld into United's backline and with the best defensive manager in football they may well become impenetrable for the foreseeable future

    Out of 10? And I assume since you're on board with your score of 8 that the higher the figure the less risk there is for us? (unless you're a gambler who likes long odds)

    I think it's something of a coin toss.. 6/10.. I would support it if it eventuated because I'm confident.. all things being equal.. that we are good enough to secure Champions League regardless of what United do.. and because Martial would most likely become an excellent player for us in the future

    Nevertheless it is still a risky deal
     
  3. Sean Emery Guest

    130k is a good wage. Accepting in principle and then requesting more is bad faith negotiation. Once he is at the club for a year I would play him in all Cup matches as a starter while rotating Foyth and Vertongen who is also entering final stage of his Spurs career (30+). Biggest disappointment has been failure to get a loan with option to buy for Mina which would allow a Sanchez Mina partnership for years to come or Mawson/Gibson to ensure another homegrown talent
     
  4. Tommy Guest

    I'll be distraught if we sell Toby to United without getting Martial or Rashford. At least to score a point against Jose. I don't want Walker's to Man City all over again, selling to our direct competitors.
     
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  5. antigooner Guest

    In my opinion. We should hang onto Toby if we can't get martial.
    Then offer him the £130k for a new contract. If he doesn't accept, just run his current contract down or possibly extend it and run it down.
    Whether he plays or not in the future at Spurs I really don't care!
    He clearly has no loyalty to the club, and like Sir Alex Ferguson, I believe no one player is bigger than our club.
    But do not strengthen MU without a player in return.
    As for signings in general, let's not forget, Lamella, Moura, Fourth and other academy players ready to step up.
    We are still a project: not quite there yet, but 1 or 2 seasons and we will be amongst the trophy's.
    COYS
     
  6. antony Active Member

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    Agree Walid! None of us are part of the THFC inner-sanctum so all opinions are just that!
    If you are a Sours fan you cannot help but admire and recognise Toby as a world class c/b and what his talent and ability has done for the club theses past seasons there's no doubt in my opinion he is as much as an influence/asset as Eriksen and Kane. BUT! Where success is based on partly team ethic and it seems obvious Toby no longer wants to be apart of that team the manager has to consider what is then best for the team. All of the above a bit long-winded, and obvious. Apologies! I am of the opinion once a player shows (not necessarily in public) he wants away a club should let him go and just get the best deal possible for the club. So.…

    1: We keep Toby but he won't sign a contract extension because 130k is not good enough to keep him and he seems set on wanting to play for Utd? So we keep him on his current deal and play him, then sell him next season for 25m. Good for team spirit/ethic?

    2: We sell him to Utd, as is his wish for 55m? Thank him for his services and that's the end of that! We have just strengthened a rival! But use the 55m to replace Toby with 5 days to go in the window? 3 weeks if we buy from Europe.

    3: We let him go to Utd and Martial comes the other way. Both players are valued similarly by their respective clubs and both players want-away from their respective clubs. Utd need a world class c/b and we need a player like Martial only 22 who under Poch could become world class and who can play (imo) wide, through the middle as a single striker or in a 2 with HK that bit deeper.

    4: We don't sell Toby to Utd this season, call his bluff, keep him on 50-60k and show a certain ruthlessness by having him sit in the stands and train with the academy players! Then move him on at 30 for 25m but maybe things/personnel has now changed at Utd and they no longer want an aging c/b for 180k per week?
    How would that be viewed by the first team squad?

    5: An option I have not thought of. So 5 is for anyone who thinks we have a 5...

    Unless option 5 proves there is another potential outcome to all this, all day long it has to be option 3 for me! It ticks all the boxes for all concerned leaving no unpleasant smell at The New Lane.
     
  7. Felon82 Well-Known Member Blogger

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    5 - the club brings itself into the modern era by paying players more their market worth B4 it gets to these situations?
    Or boosts the 1st team squad with enough quality to win things so that players want to stay long term?
     
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  8. antony Active Member

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    I think we are getting there Felon? To late probably for Alderwield but according to the Guardian....

    City wage bill last season = 225m
    Utd = 220m
    Chelsea = 218m
    Woolwich = 200m
    Liverpool = 165m
    Spurs = 121m

    I would suggest the 5 above us in wage terms are not going to increase by the same percentages than our wage bill for 18/19 now DL has agreed to loosen the purse strings and we are seeing new contracts being handed out to our top players and surely this will filter down.

    Using Dele as an example I think I am right by saying his contract has gone from 50m-100m. A 50% increase and I'm guessing (I really am) that similar percentage increases have been made throughout the squad.

    If right we are probably looking at the 18/19 seasons wage bill being around 160-180m? Point I think the others are already maxed out and we are getting closer to them rather than further away. Although City can potentially blow anyone out of the water financially.
     
  9. Walid Guest

    Number 2 is wrong. We can BUY only until 9 August. We can sell, however, to clubs whose window remains open, until the close of their transfer windows. The current situation puts English Premier League teams at a distinct disadvantage to our European neighbours, especially those involved in Champions/Europa League. Levy has worn too many hats, this Summer. His insistence on micro-managing everything has seen his two main jobs fall short of success. The stadium looks like being late and over budget (though, I don't know what the real budget is) and he has failed in his bid to secure a naming rights sponsor. His insistence at being in control of transfer negotiations has left him with little time to do both jobs well. Undoubdetly, we have suffered, as a result. As Girona FC are currently showing us, players like Amos and Eyoma, who looked decent enough in AMerica, a week ago, are nowhere near ready enough to step up to the big boys league.

    No. If Alderweireld is to go, at this late stage of the window, then Levy either has to ENSURE, Man United plays ball,by selling us Martial or Rashford, OR pays the full valuation (75m.) Anything less than one of those two results is a betrayal of Spurs fans who, on top of now being teased for having a toilet seat-shaped stadium to play in, are having to pay the highest attendance prices in Britain for the privilege.
     
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  10. Walid Guest

    Dele's salary has increased by 100%, not 50%.

    We had the largest ground in the league last year - as evidenced by smashing the Premier League attendance record TWICE and setting a new English record for Champions League group match. This season, we will move into the second-largest club stadium in the country (with the most expensive ticket prices in Premier League history.) Money is there to pay players what they could earn elsewhere.

    It's become an issue, as highlighted by Danny Rose. Levy's failure to deliver a naming rights sponsor, coupled with an over-budget new stadium is going to bite - but he PROMISED that money for transfers would be ring-fenced. Along with that, what we've heard about Kane and Alli's contracts, is that he is prepared to pay top players more than they have been getting. Alderweireld, at any top 6 club, except for ours, would be on close to 200k per week. He is as good a defender as Ledley King and those two are the best I have seen, in a Spurs shirt, since Mike England, in the 1960s.

    Levy's clearly NOT going to pay him his worth, which should be at least close to what Kane is getting...so, we have to let him go. I wish it was to a European side but it looks like being the great unwashed, of Manchester. I will HATE seeing him in their shirt, so, it is IMPERATIVE that we take from them, if nothing else but to avoid becoming a laughing stock.
     
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  11. Peter reed Guest

    just watched girona embarrass us hope none of these are playing against Newcastle or we will get thrashed can the World Cup players play or not
     
  12. Felon82 Well-Known Member Blogger

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    Excellent points Walid.
    As per usual it's Levy's antics causing these issues.
     
  13. Felon82 Well-Known Member Blogger

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    Was thinking exactly the same thing , it may be pre season but a Premier LG team at home would destroy what was out there today.
     
  14. antony Active Member

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    Some good points and correct
    Yeah, Some valid/excellent points and corrections but lets not forget it's Levy's antics that have helped us get to this stage as a club. Plus as a squad of 17-18 frontline players the majority of which have been together for the best part of 3 years only 2 want away. I like most am frustrated and want THFC/ Enic to be able to attract and pay the transfer fees and wages for top players but if we cannot (at the moment) then what we have done so far has to be congratulated imo! Plus we are 6th in the top 6 wage league and we will see at the end of next season that gap has been closed significantly. Liverpool and Woolwich are 5th and 4th in that league and what have they got in the trophy cabinet since we have emerged as a regular top 4 side that warrants their additional wage outlay?Point! What we have achieved to date on a budget, relatively speaking can only be applaudable! This debate is all about a 28 and 29 year old coming to the end of their careers and looking for one last big (4 year contract 35 million£) payday and DL realising that maybe 2 years into that new deal they may well spend more time in the treatment room as they will on the pitch and therefore prevent us from getting in replacements on a similar salary because we have tied up 70m on these 2!
    I know anyone can get injured and be out for a considerable period of time and these guys are supreme athletes but both have suffered periods out recently and I'm sure this has come into the thinking of DL.
     
    Last edited: August 5, 2018
  15. Jam Guest

    Lack of stadium naming rights is not an issue at this point.. it's actually good business.. such as when they built the Death Star in Texas some years ago.. you hold out for the right deal.. once the lavatory is revealed in all its glory someone will happily pay the appropriate amount to put their name on it
     
  16. antony Active Member

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    The Andrex Arena perhaps!!
     
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  17. antony Active Member

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    I'm reading Toby to Utd for 60mill within the next 48 hours!

    This will begin the domino effect especially if Martial does not end up coming the other way. That 60mill will go towards being invested in 120+ mill acquisitions of Grealish, either Zaha or Pulisic and a highly rated c/b maybe Lascelles?
     
  18. Walid Guest

    Trust me, Levy has been more than compensated for his work, so far. He is the highest paid executive in English football, raking in £6m in salary and bonuses, this past year. What he did is not in dispute - but he's being overly compensated for bringing in stadium, over budget, late and without securing any naming rights. Does that affect Poch's recruitment plans? You bet it does. It's evident, Toby will be gone and there's no guarantee Levy can swing Martial the other way. He's doing TOO MUCH. In the old days, Managers used to manage. These days, they just seem to oversee training, pick the team and face the media. Long before now, Levy should have handed over the transfer business to someone else, instead of micro-managing every little detail. If we get to Thursday night and have three or four transfers (in and/or out) on the go, how is he going to get them all over the line?

    It's pure speculation to suggest that a 31-year old will be injured for longer than he plays. Firstly, injuries can happen at any age - Harry Kane has spent the equivalent of a whole season out with injuries, since turning professional and he will only be 25, next birthday.

    Make absolutely no mistake about this: Losing Alderweireld is a massive blow. Not replacing him would be criminally negligent, UNLESS Foyth is deemed ready to step up. Either that, or Eric Dier may well find himself at RCB in a back three. How highly I rate Toby is that, given the choice, I would rather lose ANY other player from the first team than him. Once he's gone, however, he's dead to me. So far, this has been the worst Summer window. Levy has 4 days left to turn it around. If he fails to do so (and I am not talking about signing Grealish), then 100% of the blame lies with him because HE is the one who chooses to be a micro-manager, rather than a delegator. He's had the best part of a decade to have realised that THIS Summer, his mind and energies would be occupied in trying to deliver the stadium project. And even though it looks like a massive toilet seat, from above, I can forgive him - but ONLY if he delivers some players before time runs out. The Academy boys were totally uninspiring in Spain, tonight and, Skipp aside, I am not sure I want to see any of them lining up in the Premier League, any time soon.
     
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  19. Walid Guest

    The Harpic Bowl. It looks like a toilet because we're going to **** on Arsenal!

    On a slightly less depressing note - I've seen the results from tonight's matches in the International Champion's Cup. Inter Milan has to win it's last game by 4 goals, or else by 3 goals, scoring a minimum of 6, themselves (eg 6-3) in order to prevent us from being crowned ICC Champions! We are guaranteed top 2, as things go. COYS!:)
     
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  20. Jam Guest

    Alderweireld does not need to be replaced.. and not just because a player of his level is essentially irreplaceable for us

    We had ample opportunities to include him the second half of last season.. and for the greatest part it did not eventuate

    A back three is on the backburner for now it would seem.. I would think that is a significant part of the reason why he is now considered dispensable

    I would reiterate one thing.. selling him to United for cash alone has dumbass written all over it.. no matter how it plays out in the future
     
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