The recent past

Discussion in 'Tottenham forum' started by Jesper, February 21, 2020.

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  1. Felon82 Well-Known Member

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    During the summer it was obvious to anyone that understands football it was imperative at minimum we bought new full backs on both sides, we needed a CDM and a proper 2nd Striker as back up and also to support Kane.

    That was pretty much universally the bare minimum that was required after the chronic lack of investment.

    Then there was the couple of contracts that needed to be sorted out or dealt with Rose Toby CE etc 2 of which became very toxic

    All above was ignored or we failed at miserably before a ball was kicked that's why we are in a state because this ridiculous 'belief' that we could just carry on ignoring everything and it wouldn't come back to bite us was just that.

    N'Dombele & LoCelso look decent in flashes but still to really nail down a position in a very odd shaped weak side, Sessegnon looks scared and lost.

    The transfer buisness has been a shambles under Poch & Levy they've built this mess and now JM taking the flack for it.
     
  2. Bazza47

    Bazza47 Well-Known Member

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    Good morning Felon, I understand your feelings about how things are, we all do. We’ve jointly And severally watched this mess develop over the past few seasons, as the stadium sucked what spare cash there was away from decent new players. That and a system that allows the likes of Ndombele to be acquired instead of Fernandez, makes it all so painful. That said I feel that if we set ourselves up to only play deep, 5-3-2, we’re going to fail and if you don’t try the lad Parrott you’ll never know if he’s able to improve the current mess. Play Moura wide has to be the right solution, not surrounded by huge lumpy centre backs.

    Every week I watch pretty much all of the PL sides play better than us - pre and post Poch, faster, committed, together stuff. Man for man we ought to be able to get closer to matching that, but I’m of the view that tactically we’re so restrained. With less than good defenders, if you set yourself up to defend, you’re nailed on to fail for me......it’s going to be a painful run-in for sure.
     
  3. palmover Active Member

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    Spurs lost 3-0 to Brighton, one of the worst defeats ever nobody loses 3-0 to Brighton. That's JM's starting point start not losing to teams like Brighton and build from there.

    4pts off top4, still in both cups, spurs still have a lot to play for thanks to JM. At least spurs are not losing 3-0 to average teams. Coys
     
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  4. Felon82 Well-Known Member

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    Good morning Baz and I too agree with a lot of this , personally idv tried to bring parrot in way before Kane got injured (if we aren't buying a back up) would possibly saved poor Harry from himself and given Parrot an easier more patient inclusion.
    We're now at a point where it's a throw him in which can only go 1 of 2 ways he either hits the ground running or is like a lamb to the Wolves (no pun for Sunday). Could make or break him at 17/18 however old he is but then we've gotta look at how were playing is he gonna get a supply he thrives on or needs? Id suggest no, the main reason Kane & Son are our 2 top scorers is because they mainly manufacture their own goals out of scraps and the sole reason for this no matter how in denial a huge chunk of our fan base are is that the rest of the team isn't very good.
    (Even under Poch) there's very little intelligent positive running that's not just a JM thing, there's very little passing cohesion due to lack of movement and I'd say actual visual and game intelligence.
    So we don't dominate possession anywhere meaningful and we don't move the ball about quick enough to cause problems.
    We've looked lethargic and out muscled in many areas too, so I think pragmatically JM knows this and is trying to nagate this situation by creating gaps behind a pressed up team to exploit because let's face it we're not gonna out bully out play out pressure anyone with the personnel at hand.
    I'm not for 1 minute saying it's exciting entertaining or the answer I'm just seeing it for what it is, I can see what he's trying to do which is a massive improvement from where we have been last year n a half and it's got results that don't see us in 14th and actually have a slim chance still in CL Facup & top 4.
    The team is simply not good enough to do what people want/expect them to do just because they wear a Spurs shirt massive upgrades are needed, slating the current set up just isn't correct imo.
    And as all know on here if after a summers window and a decent chunk of next season things aren't improving then I will not be shy in telling it exactly how it is because the guys had a chance.
     
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  5. Felon82 Well-Known Member

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    Remember for those that want us to pressure and go at teams this means holding a high line with the likes of Sanchez & Aurrier who are prone to brain farts/mistakes & then a selection of Toby & Jan whos knees are gone and Davies who has never had pace.
    Winks in turn isnt imposing enough in front of them to press or cause problems to an opposing midfield, neither is N'Dombele for his 20 minute cameos.
    What people want and what we have are 2 completely different things.
     
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  6. Jose's Ghost Guest

    The team's de-evolution is fairly simple from what I can see.

    Please tell what has exactly changed that has taken us from the dominating style of yesteryear to the absolute dross of present day Jose? The manager? not really.. Poch went on the counter pretty much all of 2019. The personnel? perhaps to a degree.. Dembele was serious class but to put this malaise on one player's absence is amiss when the rest of the squad has remained fairly intact.. though our backline has now clearly fallen off a cliff.

    The answer is this... at some point in the last 12 months... I can't remember exactly when I noticed but it has become quite obvious now... Spurs have been found out to be incapable of playing out from the back when under the press.

    In years past only the very best opposition would press us high.. the rest frightened that they would be carved up otherwise. As a result we dominated possession and territory... and shots. But at some point the word got out... press our backline and they will jack it long or better yet put it into touch. Watch now and any relegation threatened team and their dog will press us high and hard in the full knowledge that they can split possession with us. As a countenance we have yielded and now prefer to sit off and play direct.

    Jose has of course taken this to another level and God help anyone who thinks his style will ever change.. it may indeed become more effective with the right personnel... but the days of us bossing sides are long gone.

    To dare is to counter... FA Cup here we come.
     
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  7. Preed

    Preed Well-Known Member

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    I still want someone to agree with me that Mourinos constant whingeing is not helping any one apart from himself.
     
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  8. Preed

    Preed Well-Known Member

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    Just a note to say that I agree with felon about the shambles created by Pochetino and levy and the shortcomings of our squad but I want Mourino to stop giving the opposition a head start with his comments
     
  9. Preed

    Preed Well-Known Member

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    Anybody see the Bayern full back last night a young Canadian lad.shows what propers scouting can unearth without spending a fortune.We can dream
     
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  10. Felon82 Well-Known Member

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    So now it looks like Alli is facing a ban too.
    That's our 3 top scorers out now, glad we've stuck with Lamela these past 6 n a half years else we'd be right in trouble.....
     
  11. Big fran Guest

    What should Jose be saying in your opinion.? The old I'm so so happy with the squad line. Happy with the project. The philosophy?
     
  12. Preed

    Preed Well-Known Member

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    Don’t be stupid big fran but he could give positive vibes Even if it’s difficult to do. How would you give a team talk if you were the opposition manager or would you just say listen to their manager who has accepted defeat before the game.Now the ***** Ali has made it even harder when he gets suspended.We do have some good players so motivate them to give their best at least.wolves at the weekend will punish any lack of effort
     
  13. Preed

    Preed Well-Known Member

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    I do look at other spurs websites and this one seems to be the only one that doesn’t criticise Mourinos Comments about having no chance till next July.Cant imagine many more managers saying the things he is saying and don’t tell me we are the only team with injuries
     
  14. THFC Guest

    Mentality is such a key part of success, especially when things aren’t going well. You need to stand as tall as possible and beat your chest to put doubt in the mind of your opponents.

    It’s survival of the fittest at this stage of the season and lack of confidence is weakness that others look for and prey on (which ultimately gives them more confidence in their ability to get a result).

    If it’s right or not, I’m not sure but week in week out trying to give the appearance that things are going well at the training ground/behind the scenes (despite the result) surely is better that openly letting people know your weaknesses and plans beforehand.

    If we then look at the 9-1 formation we seem to employ currently, any shred of doubt left in other teams as to if they should have any fears is gone. As soon as teams start playing against us and notice just how deep we are dropping again, it allows their fullbacks and midfield to become a lot more positive and invites pressure/creates chances for them. When we do good the ball forward, we have one player who despite being quick, isn’t that quick, can’t hold the ball and can’t be blamed for any of it as they are out of position. They then have no confidence and when they do get a chance at goal don’t usually take it.

    If we give the appearance that we have spent all week practicing with the players we do have, they are performing well in training and when the game starts we try to hold at least 3 players forward it would give off a much stronger appearance that we are going to be a threat.

    That being said, given how poor we are the outcome would probably end up being the same or worse but at least we wouldn’t just be laying down and taking it

     
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  15. Jesper Active Member

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    It seems that the previous manager is not yet a closed chapter. I am guessing that the chapter will never close. Arsenal will probably keep talking about Wenger, Man U about Ferguson etc. So Pochettino might yet be discussed for another couple of seasons.

    I am very curious though about what signs of improvement were seen with Pochettino during 2019?
     
  16. THFC Guest

    Where has Poch been mentioned to keep the chapter open?

     
  17. Jesper Active Member

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    So it appears that it is believed that Pochettino would have gotten the same or better result as Mourinho?
    Spurs were getting relegation level results from relegation level performances and both results as well as performances would have changed if Pochettino stayed?
    Dare I ask on what this belief is based on?
     
  18. Steve g Guest

    REBUILD WHITE HART LANE.
     
  19. Jesper Active Member

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    I tried looking for the stats for Poch, found this article:
    https://www.foxsports.com.au/footba...d/news-story/d3982cd0dd02f4278c96814e051bebc7

    The article seems balanced enough, this is one quote from it:
    "Players, who had once fought for the badge and for the manager, were playing with less commitment. Little wonder. The unsaid contract – do your bit, and the club will reward you with a transfer when the time is right – had been broken.

    There were rumours that Poch became increasingly distant with his players. Maybe both sides saw the end coming.

    Then, after just three Premier League wins all season, Levy pulled the pin. Six wins from their last 24 league matches, dating back to February 10. Relegation form, in other words."

    The emphasis is mine.
    Maybe it is all due to the summer of 2018 and the failure to sell and replace four players. Maybe not. However, if a manager has problems with his players and also with his chairman then the outcome is likely to be that the manager is the one who is moved out.
     

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