Sack the lot of em

Discussion in 'Tottenham forum' started by Felon82, March 19, 2021.

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  1. Felon82 Well-Known Member

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    Manager/s to 1 side for a moment as that's 2 these players have downed tools for.

    11 players 6 subs in total 17 highly paid footballers in the top European league all internationals and they think it's totally acceptable to not try in the NLD then lose a 2-0 lead to a farmer outfit.

    All season theyve give it the "we wanna win trophies" this has been about as credible as a toneless 12 year old saying they want to be a superstar singer.

    It's completely void of them because the mentality is worse than sparse 'talents' we have.

    These last 2 performances are the straw that broke the camel's back for me.

    How can a group of serial losers think they're that important they can just swan about sulking, not putting effort in, getting out played, out hussled and have the nerve to even think that's acceptable?

    The crux of the matter is as I've said all season and for the past few this squad needs an overhaul, not a patch up, or end of season freebies sales.
    No the deeply embedded loser culture festering within.

    Mourinho has failed and you know why?
    Because he's probably the only person in the entire club who actually wanted to win trophies but has been met with a complete circus.

    From finding out Sissoko is a big influence of the group, the having to explain to them that nice guys dont win, having to call players out like Ali & NDombele for being lazy etc

    He was also let down like every manager at Spurs by Levy, the amount of silly points lost via Sanchez & Dier this season when JM asked for Dias & Skriniar but got Rodon instead it's just an endless let down on loop.

    Is JM blameless here ? No he comes with a big rep and on big wages and hasn't really at any point got a proper tune out of it which is his job but anyone who can see beyond a red mist of hate for him can see there's been a lot of obstacles and issues.

    It's time for him to go 100% it's just not working and the players have hung him out to dry along with Poch.

    If you for a minute think the next guy isn't gonna get spat out you're delusional and far too forgiving of the players in this squad.

    I wanna see the same energy when the next guy can't get a tune out of this bunch either.

    But for now we're stuck treading water again just waiting for the final nail in the coffin for when Harry goes.

    And all of you who regularly clap failures, make excuses for sub standard performances, make excuses for not buying quality, make excuses for bang average players you're part of the festering problem at Spurs too
     
  2. Twumasi Guest

    The writer has made an obvious impression which is absolutely true that Jose want to win trophies and the players are lazy, lack concentration and positive mentality. Spur yesterday was a disgrace. With this attitude one can’t blame Jose. I will advise Levy to consider Jose one more season, total overhaul is paramount at this moment. Well in the initial stages I saw mangers who suffered same as Jose has, most of them were called to quit but to say they are having results. Ole, Arteta, all had difficulty times.
     
    Felon82 likes this.
  3. THFC Guest

    For the most part you are 100% correct however, for me, JM needs to go. His success from yesteryear means nothing at all now and he has shown at Chelsea, United and now here for the last 16 months that both his style is outdated and the players are not inspired or motivated in the slightest by him.

    Tuchel is an example of what can happen when you insert the right person with a squad that is considered to be ageing and lacking in quality to challenge.

    No matter what we do, if he stays in place, the performances, mindset, results and entertainment will be exactly the same next year (even if we give him a war chest and a clear out) because thats his way of approaching games.

    Our squad morale is destroyed and the players don’t seem to be playing for each other, let alone the manager. That again, is the managers responsibility.

    We absolutely need a mass clear out with Aurier, Doherty, Dier, Sanchez, Sissoko, Alli, Ndombele, Bergwijn,Lamela, Lo Celso, Vini and Moura all needing to go. Add to that, Lloris will want to leave...trouble is the combined sale value of them won’t be much because they are all shite.

    The reality is, for a rebuild to commence for a new manager, Kane has to be sold. We cannot start building a squad that is so reliant on a single player, which also stops other attackers joining through fear of lack of game time. We need a system that allows rotation of forwards to attract forwards and while we have Kane, as good as he is, it can’t happen. I know it’s a big call but it almost seems that we are at our Blockbuster Video moment...we are being offered Netflix...if we turn it down, as Blockbuster did, it will be something we regret later as we really need to spend £300m to sort ourselves out.

    I know it seems a lot but spending £30m to rid ourselves of JM will be the best money we could spend at this stage. If we keep him, any funds we are spending will be wasted as we will be in the exact same position requiring a clear out when he finally does succumb to his 90’s management style.

    I actually disagree with your comment around Rodon and think if he is given a run, he could fill be a grea rotational CB (far better than Dier or Sanchez) but we still need 2 x more for rotation to happen. Skipp should be able to come in and replace Sissoko. If we can pick up a couple of decent young English RB’s and some players capable of passing a ball without it flying 100 yards, we will be 100% better than we are now.

     
  4. Pickleman1967

    Pickleman1967 Member

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    Agreed that the CB situation never got properly addressed, but I suspect a large part of that was because JM thought Dier was good enough. He tried to sign him at Man Utd, he came to Spurs as a fan of the man. He was wrong about him.
    As for our attacking players; Kane, Son, Reguilon, N'Dombele, Lo Celsco, Bale, Moura etc. are not poor players, it's just that JM can't get a tune out of them. Man Utd all over again...
     
  5. THFC Guest

    I would keep Son, Regy, Bale but Lo Celso, Moura, Ndombele & Lamela need to go...the sad thing is the only one worth any money is Kane and we need the money as well as the ability to be able to rotate 3 forwards so given he probably wants to leave, we should get as much as possible then reinvest

     
  6. MikeN Guest

    The problem lies with Levy and ENIC. A complete squad overhaul to challenge for trophies will never happen as he will not spend that kind of money, even if our best player Kane is sold. JM was a big mistake which I said on the day of his appointment but because Levy is a business man and does not have a clue about football he always sees this as the solution. It doesn’t matter how many times we go through the same scenario he is far too arrogant to see it any other way.
    We really need to mount a campaign to get the current owners to sell up to someone who is interested in more than just the balance sheet. Problem is the greed of the owners is likely to set the figure way too high.
     
  7. THFC Guest

    Great article -https://apple.news/ALqR9n7obQiWEQGZDfCFQGw especially this bit rings to be so true:
    Mourinho was brought in at eye-watering expense to turn a talented squad into winners. He has failed.

    Mourinho will of course claim that he sent his players out to win the game, not just to qualify. That he didn’t send them out to timidly fall between two stools and freeze, looking every inch like they weren’t just failing to follow a plan but unaware one even existed. Mourinho will point fingers in every direction apart from the obvious one having been comprehensively outcoached by a team whose coach is in prison. This kind of apathetic, passive non-performance has happened now so often in so many games that Mourinho’s insistence it’s not the plan can just be ignored. It’s either not true or shows Mourinho is utterly unable to impart his instructions to these players. If the players are consistently failing to follow the instructions you give, that also represents a failure of management.
     
  8. Preed

    Preed Active Member

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    I would also recommend the article mentioned above by Thfc as it sums up the situation as I see it without the emotional involvement I feel when posting.I woke up this morning and expected to find out that I had dreamed the previous days events no such luck.I have supported spurs for over 50 years and have been through ups and downs including relegations but never have I felt so ashamed of a performance as I did last night.Even in our worst seasons when we got relegated the team fought hard but just lacked quality.Last night was as shambolic as any performance I have seen from a spurs team and I hope the players feel some responsibility for it although I doubt it.The team selection was flawed because no manager with any nous would start Dier Sanchez Winks Sissoko and Davies in the same team especially away from homePlease Danielmake my weekend and get rid of the greatest coach(his words) asap
     
  9. Paul Don Guest

    That man is spot on. 90% of the players cant do basics. The board have to sell up to some1 who has ambition. Up until 1991 we still won trophies fairly regularly. I think we underachieved then, with talent we have had we should have done more. 2 titles is a disgrace. Last 30 years 2 league cups. Another disgrace. Our fans now see us as no hopers. What a waste
     
    Felon82 likes this.
  10. DJD Guest

    Not many opinions I can disagree with on this forum even though there are some obvious differences of opinion amongst fans .
    I look at the games over the season and right now the players look miserable very few smiles if any apart from Son from time to time . Then of course the sniggering interaction between Winks and Dele at the start of the second half added to the pain of the result . Many of the suggestions will only mean minimum TWO years of confusion for the fans but can’t be worse than what we feel right now .
     
  11. Keith A Guest

    It’s time to get rid of all the deadwood players , who have no pride in wearing the shirt!
    We should get in a new young modern day thinking manager and give him the time for the team to gel! Otherwise we will all be debating the same scenario this time next year!
    COYS
     
  12. Preed

    Preed Active Member

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    Has nobody else wondered about the amazing fact that tottenham have10 players in next weeks international squads and it would be eleven if Columbia had not been cancelled.Kane obviously Dier unbelievablyfor England.France have lloris ndombele and unbelievably Sissoko.Denmark Hojbjerg Belgium aldy Ireland Docherty Parrot and Wales Rodon and Bale.How come these players are still being picked for their country when most have been appalling all season for us.How would you feel as a defender if you knew Dier was rated above you or what does it say about Southgate..The two Burnley centre backs would walk in our team.
     
  13. Dan Guest

    That does blow my mind. Sissoko, Dier, Dougherty, Rodon, Alderweireld all getting international caps - even if just in glorified friendlies. The players are definitely underperforming for their Club or their respective national team managers are on drugs. Could be the latter with the Dier pick. Spurs are at a very unfortunate crossroads. Jose and the players deserve a great deal of blame but Daniel Levy bears a lot of responsibility for the plight of the team. No DoF since Paul Mitchell and he fancies himself a football man when his talents outside the football commercial-business arena are modest.

    Stop looking for easy fixes. What is the operating plan for the club, the play style we want to commit to, and how do we address the perennial weak mentality throughout the whole club. It seems to me we should have incomings/outgoings metrics to judge our recruitment success and we shouldn't be afraid to sell our premier players if it's good business and allows us to upgrade the team. Commit to a DoF over several years and the manager needs to buy in to the DoF's vision. No more celebrity coach hires like Jose who are just the wrong fit for the club. To Dare is to Do and somehow we end up with Mourinho. Seriously went astray with that pick. ENIC/Levy should adopt the same tone of humility we saw from Hugo last night. Good on him. Rest of the team (other than Hart) has been AWOL today.
     
  14. Jesper Active Member

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    There has been a couple of matches now where the performance or maybe more accurately the attitude and effort hasn't been right.

    I am not a fan of the 4231-formation. My preferences are:
    433
    352
    532
    451
    442
    And only after all those then the 4231. The 4231 can work if the players are right for the formation but Spurs does not have the right kind of players for that.

    A couple of weeks ago Mourinho made some comment about: Some things can't be coached.
    At the time I thought he referred to coaching a GK to start dominating the area. Lloris is a great shot-stopper but does not dominate his area. On balance then Lloris probably stops more goals by being a great shot-stopper than conceding goals due to not dominating his area.
    Now I believe that Mourinho might have referred to more things.
    -The players in midfield still have not learned and do not know how to play the 4231
    -Willingness to take a cynical foul and a yellow to stop an attack
    -Leadership on the pitch, seeing what happens and then getting the team to adapt on the pitch.
    -Playing with intensity and purpose all the time and not only when chasing a match or when being outplayed by superior teams

    The squad for the Premier League can have 25 registered senior players and of those then only 17 can be non-HG. Spurs already have more than 17 non-HG senior players so buying a non-HG means having players who can't play and therefore pay wages for players who can't play. Possibly it might be worth it, there are a few non-HG players I don't want to see play for Spurs again and I do not think anyone would even take them on a free.
    Levy should already be familiar with what a sunk-cost is, there is nothing to be recovered by playing players who are not good enough to play just because the player is getting paid. Something can be lost by playing poor players and/or players with poor attitude. Drop them and move on.

    No more 4231 as it at best ends up being a 631 formation, the double-pivot midfielders are simply not doing their pressing right.
    From now on and until the end of the season then I want to see only players who gives effort, if the so called 'quality' players don't want to give the effort then sub them and bench them.
     
  15. Guesty Guest

    Good players playing badly can play better.
    Rubbish players playing badly will only be rubbish players.

    We have too many rubbish players.....
    Aurier, Doherty, Sanchez, Dier, Davies, Sissoko, Winks, Alli, Lo Celso, Lamela, NDombele, Moura, Bergwijn & Vinicius... need replacing. poor technically and more important....mentally. No fight in any of them. let Graham Roberts at them in a dark room.
     
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  16. THFC Guest

    Been reading today that we are linked with Rafa Benitez. Nagglesman has also stated an interest in working in London.

    If JM was to leave, do you take a gamble on Nagelsmann or go for Benitez who has experience in PL.

    I personally hope that JM is punted and we give Nagelsmann a crack as he could pull a couple of Leipzig players with him and plays a decent, pressing style....he seems to have a good morale amongst his players too which is something that is missing currently
     
  17. Felon82 Well-Known Member

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    It's no coincidence that over the past 5 years Leipzig are in the top 3 spenders in the Bundesliga and are knocking about in 2nd/3rd behind the Bundesliga giants Bayern.

    Naglesmann took over a side that had finished 3rd and are where they are based relatively on what their spend dictates.

    If he comes to Spurs hel have to transform some very average & calamitous players and work with a budget on par with Brighton & Hove Albion.

    The football Leipzig play is similar to Pochettinos early years at Spurs high press high energy which worked when we had a young energetic and quality team.

    We now have a team that is aged, injury prone and can't be bothered to run in a NLD.

    The reality of the situation is the squad needs an overhaul (as I've said all season, for a few years in fact) without this then he will also be on to a hiding to nothing.

    But if he arrives after all the salivating for him I expect you all to be as high expecting of him with the same players, none of this the players aren't listening or good enough, he needs to transform them all via coaching.

    And if its not champagne football cups & top 4 immediately I wanna see the same energy you've given Mourinho else you're hypocrites.
     
  18. Preed

    Preed Active Member

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    It is well known that I have lost all confidence in Mourino and want him gone.But having said that I agree with Felon that whoever we get next will not make any difference to results although whoever it is may play a more entertaining brand.Unless we can change at least 6 or 7 of the squad they will struggle with our dross.I was prepared to think that the players would improve with a new manager but after the no show for a north London derby and then the total ineptitude in Europe this week I can see no way that this shower will ever be able compete with teams that work hard for 90 minutes.surely in this day and age contracts can have a clause that says if you don’t do your job to the best of your ability you can be sacked as in any other walk of life and why should a failed manager get compensation copying the financial establishments.I think that cutting off their Undeserved salaries would soon shake some of them up.How can you get to a complete disaster of a player like Dier when even a international manager picks him in front of at least a dozen other centre halves
     
    Felon82 likes this.
  19. THFC Guest

    Mmmmmm...not really? I don’t believe that I have read one person on this site say that they are unhappy with JM because our performances have been energetic and positive but the results have been poor?

    Im pretty sure that the problem is and slways has been that our performances have been very negative and passive in the most part even when we have been in great positions to do better.

    In actual fact most people have said they like JM and want us/him to do more but week after week it just doesn’t happen.

    Also, not one person had said we don’t need to change at least 50% of the players.

    The hypocrisy of the happy clapping, JM fan club who seem to have more energy finding excuses about how every player in our squad is terrible and how great JM is because he won things 15 years ago is actually laughable. Any replacement manager doesn’t stand much of a chance due to the never ending complaining about how poor/aged/over achieving/under achieving our squad is and how no coach in world football can have any type of positive impact (Tuchel at Chelsea is a current example of what can happen). All constant moaning and whining being aimed at Enic & Levy despite the fact they are keeping the club running, paying off massive debts for infrastructure during a pandemic all while having almost no income at all...I think those people are quite the hypocrites.

     
  20. THFC Guest

    Just looking at today’s starting 11, can you explain the “aged” part given the average age is 25?

    Lloris 34
    Regy 24
    Tanganga 21
    Rodon 23
    Sanchez 24
    Ndombele 24
    Lo Celso 24
    PEH 25
    Moura 28
    Vinicius 25
    Kane 27

     

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