Levy & ENIC In or Out?

Discussion in 'Tottenham forum' started by Felon82, March 11, 2020.


Levy & ENIC

  1. In

  2. Out


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  1. Felon82 Well-Known Member

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    So as some of you'll know I've been of the Levy & ENIC Out stance for best part of a decade now and for a long time it's seemed that we're in a minority.

    Often being pointed towards the climb in league position, wealth, profit margins etc.

    We have a shiny new state of the art stadium and world class facilities I'm told what more can a fan want?

    Well although I seem to be a dying breed of sports fan I always grew up to think you played professional sport to win, and the merit of your achievements is the Medals/Trophies that go with being the best. (Call me old fashioned I know)

    We seem to have a new breed of fan who prioritises getting a beef brisket at half time n a NFL foam finger from the club shop telling everyone it's about the infrastructure not collecting 'pots'

    This mentality so deeply embedded in our fan base is just the perfect money source for Levy & ENIC, a fan base that doesn't think it's about winning despite the game is about glory emblazoned around the place. That alone should have them reported to trading standards.

    But after 20 years (almost) of ownership the only true test of time fact will be Spurs won 1 league cup in this time, that's what the history books will say and compared to the years previous it will look like a huge baron spell.

    People can pontificate about CL runners up/participants but only winners are remembered not participants.

    And that's all we are and have ever been under this stewardship - Participants. It's easy to say we're competitive and we are ambitious its a whole different thing actually showing/proving it.

    Buildings are of only any value to the Team if they A produce world class players or B attract them and I mean in numbers not the odd 1 here and there surrounded by average to a bloody awful supporting cast.

    All we heard was patience, we're building, once the stadium is here itl be a more level playing field....
    Was even touted as 'the game changer'

    Well it certainly has done that!

    Levy's recent comments about price hikes of season tickets and no spending money if/when we dont qualify for CL this year.

    Thats right it's our fault the fans.....
    If it wasn't Emporer Ming saying this id be shocked.

    He's also stated that with regards to transfers it's more of the same and touted Winks rise through the ranks as some sort of shining example of success.

    The stadium was built on club money and loans and with the ultimate purpose of extracting more money from more fans that's not ever gonna be put back in aggressively enough to change us from anything more than pretenders.

    The quicker people wake up to this fact and start voicefully demonstrating the better.

    Without a Trophy in sight, CL football looking to be a closed chapter bigger wages available elsewhere who in their right mind is thinking Kane/Son etc aren't weighing up their options right now?

    We are heading towards mid table at an alarming rate, in need of 6 new first team upgrade players minimum.

    No need to warn 'remember the 90s' any longer coz we're now reliving it in a souless bowl for more money.

    The never project continues.......

    So are you Levy & ENIC In or Out?
    Last edited: March 11, 2020
    bruski and Gordon Mc like this.
  2. Bazza47

    Bazza47 Well-Known Member

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    The thing is Felon if you run a top PL side without financing losses or pumping in loads of cash/both, then you’re not going to be able to acquire top talent and spend big. FFP was put in place to address Chelski and Abramovich, Citeh might just have enough cash to drag things through the courts for 10 years, so will get away with it.

    We’re different - a club ran within it’s means. I might not like it, but I know that’s how it’s going to be. New owners would be hamstrung with the FFP rules and any transition has to be 5 years away minimum. No Academy feeds like all the other top clubs, no CL cash......I’m not sure if I’m up for the long haul - I’ll be nearly 80 by then....scary thought for sure.
  3. Luke1975 Guest

    As a long term supporter of spurs I too am dismayed by the state of the team and the football we are playing. I think the manager should be given the chance to bring in his own players and implement his desired system of play. We have been very unfortunate with the injury situation this season and unless you are crazy you must realise this is the reason for the situation we find ourselves in. since poch came in I have found a new joy in watching spurs and this year I have watched every game with the sense of being disappointed before it even kicks off.
    levy and Enic have provided funds for the team in a reasonable manner and the highs we have hit which I never thought I would see in my lifetime have been a justification of their management of the club. there are only five competitions every year available to win domestically and in Europe and generally we have been right up there challenging for them. It is ridiculous to think that we have a god given right to win year in year out.
    the money in the game has provided a more level playing field for any pl team to challenge and I think that next year with maybe a few additions and def a second striker we will be up there again.
    Keep the faith support the team
    voiceofreason and Jesper like this.
  4. Paul the Don Guest

    I have been saying this for years. Our club should be as big as United. Was before. 2 titles & none for 60 years is a disgrace. Spend right. I want trophies, league titles especially. ENIC out.
  5. Felon82 Well-Known Member

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    No one is saying this , but the team should at least be given a fighting chance to achieve this.
    Starting every season without a balanced 1st team and absolutely no depth to a 'squad' having watched this repeatedly bite us on the backside every year is as contemptuous as it is negligent from an ownership in its 20th year.
    The only year a 1st team that had quality in every position was 2016/17 it was just missing depth and we finished 2nd it was then it needed the investment but it never came and not a single player has been upgraded from then and no quality in depth has arrived.
    That's not entitlement it's just p;ss poor support/ambition from the board which has led to yet another capitulation.
    Give the managers a fighting chance with the basics of a squad like quality 1st 11 and quality cover.
    If they do that then it's at least down to the manager then, but the list of casualties from the ENIC reign all stem from managers working with 1 hand tied behind their backs.
    Which for any sane fan is not good enough.
  6. Cheshuntboy Guest

    I was certainly in favour of sacking Pochettino, and was very happy with Mourinho's appointment, but I have to say that this season is proving far more painful than even a perennial pessimist like me expected. The sad truth is that Spurs are in a much worse state than any club Mourinho's previously managed, and if Levy isn't prepared to spend very big indeed on the team, I can't see us competing even for the top four any time soon, let alone actually winning (yes, WINNING!) that elusive trophy. Everything points to yet another ill-judged, panicky decision by Levy in appointing a manager who doesn't do the long haul, and paying Mourinho fifty million per year instead of a paltry fifteen isn't going to turn duds like Ndombele and Aurier into the players we thought Pochettino had signed, or make the state of the art academy produce state of the art players, rather than the succession of nobodies who've graduated to date. The highest praise ENIC/Levy ever got from their admirers was that Spurs hadn't 'done a Leeds', but 'doing a Spurs' seems hardly any better at the moment, and the future looks anything but rosy. All this, floods and coronavirus - Peter Knowles was bound to be right eventually.
  7. Felon82 Well-Known Member

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    Without investment we will be struggling against them next season as things are
  8. Bazza47

    Bazza47 Well-Known Member

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    Is it me or am I missing something. There is no way we have a chance of materially affecting the squad this year, not a snowball’s. Why?

    - no CL Revenues - talent money and gate receipts circa £100m, pretty much all to the bottom line, as makes no difference.

    - That massively long list of “get rid offs” ...Hugo and/or Gaza, Aurier, Sanchez, Verts, Lamela, whoever else....are not going to fetch a row of beans, and Levy will not spend before we secure any sales deals.

    - DL’s comments minuted at the THFC Supporters Trust meeting about investment in the squad, views on the depth of the squad, lack of striker replacement....etc,etc.

    - if we did have money to spend, every piece of recent evidence suggests we just cannot spend wisely - take Fernandez plays Ndombele. We paid fifty four fecking million £’s for him ......truly beyond belief.

    - and Lo Celso just won’t be able to do all the creating on his own...
  9. Jose's Ghost Guest

    I will abstain from the vote because ultimately my ambivalence (could you have maybe put in a 'maybe' option?) makes no difference to the decision making of the club. I mean how long has Newcastle been absolutely howling for Ashley's head... a truly hopeless owner... and nothing ever changes there.

    Levy has done well in some respects and not so well in others. The positives are there to see... the negatives? The club is too circumspect especially financially which is thoroughly ironic given our history and creed. As an example, allowing three key players to run down their contracts was incredibly poor management as was going into this season with only one recognised striker. Remarkable and derisible.

    Levy by all accounts though is not going anywhere anytime soon and the club at least has some apparent ambition under his leadership to go to the final level... though it has been an absolute slow burn. I don't think there is much that can be done... that's just the Spurs of the new millennium.
    Bazza47 likes this.
  10. Jose's Ghost Guest

    Jose needs to be careful with Ndombele as do we. He already publicly alienated his most gifted midfielder at his previous club... much to his own detriment... and likewise had our previous manager and the fans been more patient we might not have had to wait two seasons to see the very best of what Sissoko has to offer.

    Ndombele is an exceptionally talented footballer... certainly a cut above anything we have in that position. There are aspects of his game presently that need to improve but he does not have to run around like a headless chicken to impress. I will take a team of languid savants over a side of talentless try-hards each and every day of the week.

    He should be starting every match.
  11. Paul the Don Guest

    Dont expect to win something every year. No divine right. But as i said no title for 60 years with all the talent weve had but no balanced team is a disgrace. No FA cup for 30 , no european for 37. 1 league cup in 20. What i expect is to challenge far more often, not have inferiority complex to the other big 5 , & at least a period of dominance at some time in my life. 55 now & still waiting. I would accept 10th 1 year like Chelsea with titles in & around year after & before
  12. THFC Guest

    It’s great question and one that is very difficult to answer. I think it really depends on who is looking to buy the club as you need to be careful what you wish for in that regard.

    Look at the state of the club prior to ENIC and Levy and there were times when the very existence of the club was at risk.

    We have a very solid club that is in a great financial position but that doesn’t invest in playing positions particularly well (so that does need to change).

    On the flip side, there are sides that are carrying massive debts who have thrown lots of money at players who still haven’t won anything.

    I personally think ENIC are ok, I would prefer a change of chairman to someone who is a a little more open minded about investment and a little less controlling of the manager/head of recruitment to allow them to actually do their jobs.

    I still believe the decision to employ JM was a mistake based on our ability to spend and his background/history of success and that was Levy’s fault.

    Perhaps a new chairman, with a restructure of recruiting (again) would be a safer change than a club sale?
  13. Preed

    Preed Well-Known Member

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    All the talk about the lack of strikers has hidden the fact that the reason we can’t win is because we are so bad defensively.There is only one team in the premiership that has conceded more goals since Mourino took charge than us and that is Aston Villa.I thought he was supposed to be the best defensive coach in the league but has made us relegation standard in defencePlease don’t post mitigating circumstances about injured strikers as Mourino is doing repeatedly.Make us hard to beat Jose and stop whingeing
    Bazza47 likes this.
  14. Spurporter Well-Known Member

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    Levy IN. ENIC IN.
    I am against firing managers, was for keeping Poch and I think JM has to be given time and money to succeed. New owners will not feel obligated to give Mou time and money needed, they will have their manager instead. Plus, it is not a realistic proposal. A Club is sold when they are in good shape, not in desolation we are now.
    Mourinho was meant to be a bridge type of gaffer. The long term target must be identified. I think, if Leipzig knocked off of UCL at some point this season and will not win next the current RB manager and his entire back room must be targeted, as they may be available.
  15. Bazza47

    Bazza47 Well-Known Member

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    Being exceptionally talented is great, if you can’t show it or deliver, then quite frankly I lose interest. I’ve never seen Lo Celso before but, for me, he’s been a breath of fresh air and more than capable of eclipsing Eriksen, as for Ndombele if he doesn’t get his backside in gear he will lose support from the crowd, if he hasn’t done so already.
  16. Felon82 Well-Known Member

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    Have you seen how bad our GKs , FBs and CBs are and to top it off Winks shielding them ?????
    I'm sorry but I'm gonna have to disagree again that this is all JMs fault.
    Do you genuinely think he says Aurrier be out of position as much as you possibly can give away penalties and get red cards, Davies if you could be slow and also take a nap at times, Toby n Jan you don't need to organise your defensive line and as your knees are going drop really deep and don't press or shut down any attackers, Sanchez & Dier just give the ball away as much as possible and don't worry about picking anyone up, Foyth see Dier & Sanchez for tips on how to improve, Winksy your job is to pretend to be busy and not put a foot in or pick up late runners, and how can I forget Hugo my Captain and Vorm if you could both not catch command and be sh;te at kicking that would be great.
    Now while these guys are doing this job for me could the rest of you stand like statues looking glum and offer no outlets if we do get the ball?
    That's it your all executing my plans perfectly........

    The players are unprofessional and shocking , have been for a while.
    They need moving on and upgrading in the summer no excuses.
    If JM tries and it's blocked it's not his fault, if he doesn't try and is complicit in this shambles then by all means he deserves criticism for it.

    Anyone would think these players have been strong solid water tight stalwarts pre JM they weren't, they've been a joke for ages none of them take responsibility none of them talk none of them learn from their catalogue of mistakes none of them lead by example.
    It needs ripping up and starting again.
    Last edited: March 11, 2020
  17. Guesty Guest

    I’d say Levy has backed every manager....to some extent.
    He gave £54m to buy NDumbele ffs!
    What Levy has to do is trust the manager’s choices. For me...in the main over the last few seasons...the choices have been sh1t.

    we are a club that can’t seem to buy a £5m genius. Bale was one. Alli should have been one.
    But buying cheap and taking a risk is one thing....spending big money on **** players is another.

    If someone can explain how NDombele, Foyth, Sanchez, Moura, Gedson & Aurier get anywhere near our starting team...I’d be pleased to hear it. Sh1t players.
    add to that average players like Alli, Winks, Lamela, Davies, Dier, Sess.....
    I’m not sure what is expected of Levy about his manager’s choices

    I’ve said before....we need to take it on the chin in the next couple of seasons and work on a youth team. Start again.
  18. THFC Guest

    Who scouted then chose these players?

    For example, who picked Sanchez out as a decent, reliable CB? Who picked Ndombele as having the fitness and desire to play in PL? Who looked at Gedson and decided that he was going to be able to make a difference, especially in the short term? Who looked at Moura and thought he would be a really good attacking option for us. Don’t get me started on Aurier....

    I cannot believe any of the players above were scouted properly and certainly don’t believe that either JM or MP asked for them.

    Levy has built himself a reputation for being a tough negotiator but all that does is limit the people willing to deal with you.

    The whole “special relationship” with Real Madrid is an example of just how great he really is at negotiating. We have never signed a decent player from them, even when they are available.

    I think we are looking at sides like City, Real and Man Utd when in actual fact we should be looking at Athletico and Borussia Dortmund as inspiration as to what we should be doing year in and year out.

    JM is in no way fully to blame for our situation because he does have some woeful players. That being said his job is to get the best out of what we have and if we can’t attack, at the very least we should be drawing every game 0-0. We cannot defend and his appointment has made absolutely no difference to that.

    If I had a choice, I would remove Levy and JM and keep ENIC.

    I would then get a Chairman that is willing to work with a head of recruitment and coach with all player decisions being made by the two former. They can they be held responsible if it doesn’t work but allows them to choose and build on their own accord.

  19. Jose's Ghost Guest

    Gladly. They're all internationals... and for nations such as France, Argentina, Brazil, Portugal... which are nations basically all better than England at football. Hope that helps.
  20. Preed

    Preed Well-Known Member

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    Does Mourino not tell Aurier in training about his positioning on the pitch or tell the rest of the players what they are not doing properly if he does not then he is not doing his job.Im sorry Felon but you surely must hope that Mourino does organise training with a view to improve the players bad as they may be.We do have a load of players who have lost all confidence but the manager is not blameless
    Bazza47 likes this.

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