Matchday discussion

Discussion in 'Tottenham forum' started by bigfran, September 14, 2018.

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  1. Cheshuntboy Guest

    Of the numerous aspects of modern football that I don't get, this business of buying players and then leaving them on the bench (if they even make the squad at all!) is one of the most infuriating. Sanchez has surely proved by now that our £42 million was spent making Ajax's weakest link in 2017 into Tottenham's in 2020; we've just bought a central defender with international experience, who surely can't do a worse job, and yet we don't play him! Pochettino infuriated me by saying that new players needed whole seasons to adapt to his methods (but were still paid fortunes from day one), but Mourinho has got to put the needs of the club over mollycoddling individuals - if they're good enough, play them and, if not, get rid!
     
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  2. Genevaspurs Guest

    I understand and agree with this analysis on Sanchez. I would like to remember that it is Ledley who is in charge of the defenders and that our main problem comes from this part of the field and for a while now. We can blame Davies and Sanchez on this goal and it is normal but if we had lost yesterday it's also because we were unable to score goals ! Unable to create real and clear scoring opportunities. This is the real reason for our defeat in Belgium...
     
  3. Felon82 Well-Known Member

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    The constant errors are ridiculous though, I can't think of another side that has so many defenders that all have a massive clanger in them collectively at any one point.
    For professionals they're embarrassing to watch.

    The entire Antwerp defence would be a massive upgrade on the stockpile of clowns we have.
     
  4. Preed

    Preed Active Member

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    I agree that the Antwerp defence was far better than our error prone misfits but they also defended as a team including their midfield.The second half was only 1 minute old when Winks presented Antwerp with a glorious chance to score a second goal which they messed up .I despair that a manager renowned for his defensive teams goes into an important game with no defensive cover in midfield and then when he brings on Hojbjerg he leaves Winks on.Most free kicks given away near our area is usually a foul byWinks or Aurier.As much as I despair at Sissokos lack of control he does at least put in a defensive stint.One of Hojbjerg or Sissoko should always be in the team to cover the weakness in our back four.Rondon is now able to play and I hope Jose throws him in immediately and gets ledley to coach Sanchez on the basics of defending.I can’t believe we paid 42million for him and Ajax seemed to have improved since
     
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  5. Bazza47

    Bazza47 Well-Known Member

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    Horror show. Didn’t bother with the Jose post match, but if he put his hand up for some blame, that’s only fair as mixing so many average players with ones with no match fitness was criminal. I’ve always felt that balance in the defence, as in left or right footed, is essential. The lack of a top quality left footed centre back is exposing our weakness in that area. Why leave Winks on, play one HMF and push Lo Celso further forward. As for Dele - managed to do everything badly.

    And Royal Antwerp were excellent. Whoever did the intelligence report on them needs a rocket up their backside...or JM does for not taking enough attention.

    We better win on Sunday - hopefully H&S are in better form than they were last night.
     
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  6. THFC Guest

    Why oh why would anyone play Sanchez and Aurier at the same time. I think that Jose’s intention was ok but he really underestimated just how good the team performance of Antwerp would be.

    Sanchez and Aurier are basically the same players, with no ability to cover positions defensively and no real basic defending idea. When you add that to poor distribution and terrible timing, they really are a nightmare waiting to happen.

    Ben Davies is another whose performances are so inconsistent. He is not a CB so should not be played there, the only time he looks ok is the left side of a back 3 not in a back 4.

    Then sitting Winks in front of the players above is just a terrible decision as he offers no protection at all and will often give the ball away in the space in front of the 2 x CB’s. I have said it before and I know some don’t agree but Sissoko must play, especially when the back line is so weak as he adds so much defensively across the entire back line.

    Add all of that to trying to rotate squad players that are not fit, committed or good enough and that loss was always going to happen especially given how much Antwerp wanted to win.

    Dele should not get another game...his attitude is terrible and has been for some time.

    It’s only an away game in a group fixture with a group that isnt very good and I think Jose knew that so despite the result I don’t think we need to be too concerned.

    The real test is what happens with Brighton after the Burley game.
     
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  7. Spurporter Active Member

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    During the first period I went on line to check Antwerp's HC name. I knew it wasn't Pochettino, but they play so much of Poch football, that I had to. By 70 minute I hoped they will get tired, but they continued to press all over, ruining all that Spurs have tried to do regardless of whom JM put on the pitch.
    Our B team was what it is - a second team, but they didn't put out such a poor performance they were accused of. How many games did Spurs win with new Bale?
    Mou was at fault. He didn't accurately assessed the opponent and did not prepare for the game properly. Rarity it is. JM admission of his fault was also rare. It removes any doubts as to what was the reason for the loss.
    The question is Was it Intentional? It's a long shot, but nothing is a long shot with Mourinho. Losing away in group stage carries the least ramifications compared to a loss in any different competition. Dele didn't want to leave? Who knows... But Dele is done with Spurs, I agree.
     
  8. Preed

    Preed Active Member

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    Spurporter you can’t leave Pochetino out of your posts move on.I agree that Mourino should take some of the blame for poor team selection and I do think he under estimated the opposition but to say that the team did not put up such a poor performance you must be joking.we did not create one chance and could easily have conceded 3.Bale was poor but to put all the blame on him is ridiculous he will need at least another month to regain proper fitness and then we can judge.I am reserving judgement myself because nobody really knows what 2 years with practically no football has done to him but I suspect that you think we should not have gone after him at all??please don’t suggest that Mourino deliberately lost this game as that should not be in any managers dna
     
  9. Jesper Active Member

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    First off, I can start match-threads but if I don't have the time to do it then maybe someone else might want to do it or?

    The latest match...
    When the star-players are also the hardest working players then the rest of the team usually follows their example and work hard. Son and Kane are incredibly hard-working, they are leading by example so players who do not follow their lead might not need to be part of the team. Sad but that is how I feel.

    It looked like some of the attacking players were not making runs as they wanted to save their energy for better opportunities. In my opinion it does not work that way, the attacking players have to make runs where there is a chance that the ball might be played, if they constantly avoid making runs as the pass might not come their way then almost no attack will happen.
    If there is a 50% of getting/winning the ball then the effort has to be made because not competing means there is a 100% certainty of a loss.
    It is easy to press a team that stands still, Spurs players appeared to have given up making runs and by not making runs due to the press so they gave up the match.

    A couple of players might not have had match-sharpness. That is excusable and the only way to fix is by playing them. But the ones who were playing, fit to play and did not make the effort they put in inexcusable performances. Better to run, the legs get dead and then get substitued rather than saving energy for better opportunities that might never come.

    The conceded goal was due to Davies not passing the ball but the only option he had was to play it back to Lloris and Davies was to slow in making that decision. The one certainty is that if Sissoko had been playing then he would not have been available to receive a pass. This match was for players willing and able to receive and pass the ball, Sissoko is for matches when the opposition has the ball and he might maybe be useful there.

    The team that was sent out had the quality to win the match but they didn't make the effort. Winning is a habit and closely linked to the habit of making the effort. I am not sure what the next step might be, possibly play the ones who didn't make the effort and see if they learned or possibly drop them. If they make the effort in training then maybe play them, if they don't make the effort in training then don't play them.
     
  10. Jesper Active Member

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  11. Preed

    Preed Active Member

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    Half time report .I wish I could get a refund of 14.95 because this is as bad as the midweek rubbish.Since award of soft penalty Brighton have dominated in every aspect.We have not put together one decent passing move and all the players are static.Only attacking idea is lump it forward and hope for a lucky bounce,Our penalty was no worse than Doherty hold on their forward we were lucky not to concede penalty.still can’t see the excitement over Doherty.Even bottom teams put together at least one passing move
     
  12. Preed

    Preed Active Member

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    Second half a bit better but not great.Celso upped the tempo and Gareth got another 20 minutes.we’re you watching Spurporter Bale did not put the mockers on us but scored the winner.still can’t explain why we let inferior teams dominate possession for long spells when we are at home.Now second in league which doesn’t say too much about the quality of the premiership
     
  13. THFC Guest

    Well that wasn’t great to watch. Having watched what JM tells the players to do on the documentary then seeing what they actually do on the pitch makes each game quite difficult to follow. The result was great but the performance wasn’t however it is nice to get Bale off the mark.

    Lets see what happens in the next game I suppose....we surely can’t play much worse than we have in the last 2 games which means the future is bright if we can pick up 3 points playing like that.

    Performance wise, I only thought that Toby & Sissoko actually played well, the rest were poor to ok. A question I have to ask myself is how can Son be the best forward in world football one week then completely anonymous the next?
     
  14. Felon82 Well-Known Member

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    So seeing as we're now 2nd has JM pulled us from mid table obscurity and transformed the club?
     
  15. Cheshuntboy Guest

    On paper Spurs are good enough for a title challenge, so why are we so unconvincing so much of the time? The players can't put games to bed, even against lower mid-table teams like our last three home PL opponents, and Mourinho compounds matters by putting on Davies in place of Son, thereby reducing our capacity for a breakaway goal to zero!
    Yes, we were robbed over Brighton's goal but Kane's was clearly not a penalty, and he was back to his 2018 WC antics, backing into the opponent and then going down as if he were the victim, not the perpetrator. We're clearly equipped to see off gung-ho opponents like the Uniteds and Southamptons of a few weeks ago, but we've struggled in all our other PL games (and some of the EL ones), and really need the midfield to gel; Ndombele and Lo Celso are still showing only in patches, Sissoko does exactly what it says on the tin (contents: one seriously limited footballer, close to sell by date), while Alli and Winks are already past it, despite being well short of their supposed 'prime'.
    There is clearly need and room for improvement, but we need to find a best eleven and keep the tinkering to a minimum, and if that means no more Sanchez, Alli, Winks, Lamela or Aurier, so much the better.
     
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  16. Preed

    Preed Active Member

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    Felon I think you are jumping the gun a bit.Agree we are in a better place than the last few months of Pochetinos reign but the last 3 performances have been poor and if we can’t up our performances we may be back in mid table very quickly.I believe we still need 3or 4 top class players and need to unload quite a few.I want to be able to watch my team play with a passion and purpose and at the moment that ain’t happening.Kane yesterday cheated to get penalty and we were lucky not to concede when dochertypulled their centre forward.Dier once again handballs in penalty area and a week ago this would have been a penalty.Son goes from world class to abysmal in the space of a week although the midfield yesterday did not help.After our first goal Brighton completely dominated us and if the had a striker we would have been in trouble.Good point Bale getting more time to get properly fit.I want us to press teams not sit back after 10 minutes and allow opposition to have the ball
     
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  17. Bazza47

    Bazza47 Well-Known Member

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    We’ve only played two other teams that are in the top half of the table, so I reserve judgement Felon. These last two games have shown how we can be so very Spursy......yesterday was such a painful watch, as we failed to string a decent move together. City will be a good indicator......
     
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  18. Felon82 Well-Known Member

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    Haha Tongue in Cheek......

    Let's be fair the football has been atrocious in many a game for at least the last 2 years, I don't believe for a second JM wants them to go into their shell and be unable to keep the ball or push up.
    This is the players and their skill/mindset. You can't play a pressing game without everyone on board and working as a unit, I think we carry some lazy players in our team and we also lack intelligent movement of the ball and people off it in the midfield areas.
    The only way that changes is to get players in that can do that and stop carrying so many starters who just repeat the same sh!t over and over.

    But 2nd in the table not playing well can be a good sign, we tend to raise our levels against bigger teams aswell.

    It's not all doom n gloom we are getting there I believe.
     
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  19. Jesper Active Member

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    Possibly Spurs lost the battle over the midfield as Sissoko was defending so deep that he wasn't part of the midfield?
    Possibly Brighton won the battle over the midfield as they had their attackers dropping down into midfield to win the midfield?
    A combination of the two?
    As it was then it was a win, few chances conceded so something was done right.

    The off the ball movement, both attacking and defending, has been bad for a long time. There might be some signs of improvement but the necessary rotation does not help
     
  20. Felon82 Well-Known Member

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    With all the doom n gloom touted if you look at the league table we're the top scorers 18 in 7 and have the joint best defence in the top 5.

    Considering how poor we're presumed to be playing that's pretty damn good.

    This time last year we were already 12 points off the top.
    When we are good we are very good but when we are poor we are still overall getting results.
    It will get better with more game time remember we've signed 7 players and are still in transition whilst carrying a lot of average players.
     
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